Lloyds/HBOS share price Monitor

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  • ad44downey
    ad44downey Posts: 2,246 Forumite
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    Lloyds massively overpaid for the sick man of the banking sector, HBOS.. 50 pence would still be too much. HBOS, a shoddily run excuse for a bank, was on its knees and would have went belly up today if the deal hadn't been done last night. HBOS and the government were desperate and Lloyds could have got a much better deal for its shareholders.
    Krusty & Phil Madoff, 1990 - 2007:
    "Buy now because house prices only ever go UP, UP, UP."
  • sabretoothtigger
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    That peston guy again, fsa says no more short selling on uk shares apparently

    A good thing maybe or it could just make the falls sharper perhaps

    U.K. Regulator Stops Short Selling of Bank Shares (Update1)
    By Caroline Binham
    Sept. 18 (Bloomberg) -- The U.K. markets regulator introduced new rules today that temporarily halt the short selling of shares in financial institutions, following similar moves from the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission.
    The Financial Services Authority will also require daily disclosure of short trades in the companies when the positions are over 0.25 percent, the London-based regulator said in a statement. Both rules will remain in effect until Jan. 16.
    The rules were introduced after politicians and some investors blamed short-sellers for the drop in HBOS Plc shares, which fell 37 percent before merger talks were announced yesterday with Lloyds TSB Group Plc.
    ``While we still regard short-selling as a legitimate investment technique in normal market conditions, the current extreme circumstances have given rise to disorderly markets,'' said Hector Sants, the FSA's chief executive officer, in an e- mailed statement. ``We have taken this decisive action, after careful consideration, to protect the fundamental integrity and quality of markets and to guard against further instability in the financial sector.''



    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a9.4Fln7esaI&refer=home
  • sabretoothtigger
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    LLOY.L LLOYDS TSB 297.20 p 1:23AM up_g.gif59.70 (25.14%) 575,000
    :confused:http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/q/cp?s=%5EFTUB8300


    [SIZE=+1]Moody's may cut Lloyds TSB, HBOS ratings[/SIZE]
    Sept 18, (Reuters) - (The following statement was released by the rating agency)
    Sept 18 - Moody's Investors Service today announced that it had placed the
    BFSR and long-term ratings of both Lloyds TSB and HBOS(LSE: HBOP.L - news) and
    their associated subsidiaries on review for possible downgrade. The rating
    action follows the announcement that the entities are planning a merger.
    The B+ financial strength rating of Lloyds TSB Bank plc along with its Aaa
    senior debt and long-term deposit ratings, as well as the Aa1 senior debt
    rating for Lloyds TSB Group (LSE: LLOY.L - news) were all placed on review for possible downgrade.
    The B financial strength rating of Bank of Scotland plc along with its
    Aa1 senior debt and long-term deposit ratings, as well as the Aa2 debt rating
    for HBOS plc (the holding company for Bank of Scotland) were all placed on
    review for possible downgrade. The ratings of HBOS and its banking operations
    were already on negative outlook following the announcement in April that the
    group had taken substantial negative fair value adjustments and reflecting the
    vulnerability of the bank to the deteriorating economic environment in the UK.
    The Prime-1 short term ratings of both banks were affirmed.
    The merger would create the largest retail financial services group in the UK,
    whose entities had combined assets of over GBP1 trillion at the end of June
    2008. The enlarged group estimates it will have a leading position in core
    retail financial products and in household insurance and bancassurance, and be
    the third-largest player in mid-market commercial banking.
    However, Moody's considers the merger of two large financial institutions,
    which poses significant integration risks, will face additional challenges
    given the difficult conditions in the global financial markets and the
    deteriorating economic environment in the UK.
    The review will focus on the following:
    - Capital strength of the enlarged group and assumptions for future capital
    levels. In this respect, Moody's considers it a positive development that the
    final dividend for the enlarged group I 2008 will be paid in shares and that
    Lloyds TSB will subtract HBOS' negative fair value adjustments in the AFS
    reserve from its capital calculations.
    - Cost and revenue synergies: Moody's believes that the considerable
    duplication across the two organisations offers significant potential cost
    synergies, however implementing cost reductions and reducing balance sheet
    exposures could have negative repercussions for the firm's reputation in the
    current weak economic environment
    - Quality of the joint loan books and vulnerability to the deteriorating
    economic environment in the UK. Moody's said that it will consider the on-going
    robustness of the commercial property loan book of both firms, given the rapid
    decline in property values. With regards to residential mortgages, Moody's
    noted that Lloyds TSB's mortgage book (the Cheltenham and Gloucester brand) has
    a conservative profile with impairment charges still low at 0.09% of average
    mortgage lending in H108. In contrast, the rating agency said that HBOS'
    mortgage book contains a substantial element of specialist mortgage lending
    (28% of the group's mortgage portfolio, and around 15% of the group's overall
    loan portfolio) and arrears across both the standard and specialists books have
    deteriorated.
    - Funding profile of the enlarged group
    - HBOS' structured securities portfolio and the extent to which a further
    deterioration in market conditions could lead to additional substantial
    negative fair value adjustments (particularly given the potential for further
    stress on market prices following the Lehman bankruptcy).
    - The legal structure of the group and its subsidiaries post-merger
    Moody's noted that the merger is subject to regulatory and shareholder
    approval, but considers that it is extremely likely to go ahead, and is
    expected to be finalised by end 2008/early 2009.
    Moody's also placed under review for possible downgrade the Aa2 Insurance
    Financial Strength Rating ('IFSR') and A1 subordinated debt ratings of the
    Clerical Medical Investment Group Limited as well as the Aa1 IFSR and Aa3
    subordinated debt ratings of Scottish Widows plc, reflecting the companies'
    ownership and expected level of support.
    The Aa2 deposit rating of Lloyds TSB Offshore Ltd was also placed on review for
    possible downgrade, in line with the action on Lloyds TSB Bank plc.
    The Aa3 deposit rating of Bank of Scotland (Ireland) was also placed on review
    for possible downgrade, in line with the action on its parent, as was the Aa3
    deposit rating of Bank of Western Australia Ltd.
    At the end of June 2008 Lloyds had total assets of GBP368 billion and HBOS
    total assets of GBP681 billion. Lloyds is headquarted in London and HBOS in
    Edinburgh.
  • setmefree
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    Share Price 310.00....30.53% up :T
  • sabretoothtigger
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    I saw 3.90 earlier, very spiky market
  • setmefree
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    I saw 3.90 earlier, very spiky market

    Yep i think it's a case of give it a week again and see how it pans out.
  • Nick_C
    Nick_C Posts: 7,460 Forumite
    Name Dropper First Anniversary First Post Home Insurance Hacker!
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    Interesting that HBOS is still trading at a 10% discount against Lloyds

    eg Lloyds = 321p so HBOS should be (83%) 266.4p, but currently 240p
  • sabretoothtigger
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    Yea thats the risk that the merger wont happen. Trustee block or something apparently.
    At this point I would just buy lloyds I think, in theory its free money to be made but who needs more risk right now. The ratio is slipping upwards I noticed
  • setmefree
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    Yea thats the risk that the merger wont happen. Trustee block or something apparently.
    At this point I would just buy lloyds I think, in theory its free money to be made but who needs more risk right now. The ratio is slipping upwards I noticed

    I completely agree, Lloyds would be preference
  • fatpig_2
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    Lloyds are/were a good bank. hbos were chronic and indebted up to their eyeballs

    I hope Lloyds know what they're doing taking on this pile of shiite
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