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  • FIRST POST
    • MSE Archna
    • By MSE Archna 5th Aug 08, 11:55 AM
    • 1,874Posts
    • 6,140Thanks
    MSE Archna
    The Great ‘Home Heating’ Hunt: Do you know cheaper ways for LPG and oil
    • #1
    • 5th Aug 08, 11:55 AM
    The Great ‘Home Heating’ Hunt: Do you know cheaper ways for LPG and oil 5th Aug 08 at 11:55 AM
    Why this discussion.

    For the many people that have no choice in heating their home & cooking using oil or LP (Liquefied Petroleum) gas finding the cheapest isn't easy. While gas and electricity comparison sites for conventional energy are commonplace, this isn't the case for LPG and oil.

    Add to this there is no obvious regulating body for this area and limited choice of providers in some areas, it's hard to save money.

    We need your help and ideas

    I thought I'd tap MoneySavers' knowledge to collate tips and tricks to save on the cost of these types of fuels. As it so difficult to save hopefully the collective wisdom will help everyone.

    How to suggest something...

    Simply click reply, if you're not already a member of the forum, you'll need to login. Don't worry its free and you'll never be emailed, its just done to stop spammers.

    This thread replaces the older Cheaper Oil For Fuel thread, which with the massive price escalation is now out of date.

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    Last edited by MSE Martin; 06-08-2008 at 10:16 AM.
    Report inappropriate posts: forumteam@moneysavingexpert.com




Page 1
    • chubbybrown4real
    • By chubbybrown4real 6th Aug 08, 12:15 AM
    • 101 Posts
    • 21 Thanks
    chubbybrown4real
    • #2
    • 6th Aug 08, 12:15 AM
    • #2
    • 6th Aug 08, 12:15 AM
    Ask for Calor Home heat when using 47kg,you need to buy at least two at a time,its a lot cheaper.
  • Liquid Stool
    • #3
    • 6th Aug 08, 12:46 AM
    old posts 23ppl!!!
    • #3
    • 6th Aug 08, 12:46 AM
    Hey all,

    just checked the old posts and was astonished at the price, on average 25ppl+vat.

    I had a top up of 401 litres yesterday and it cost me a whopping 57.9ppl +vat that was from TOTAL BUTLER, expensive yes, but in actual fact, the price had dropped for 2 weeks in a row and it's always a gamble as to when you buy, however, that should see me through now til the end of feb when hopefully i'll pay around 40ppl = you think thats bad?

    My old man lives in a park home, last year despite the heating being on all day long the temp in the van never go above 18 degrees, through the winter it cost him nearly a Ł1000 in gas bottles.

    It's totally unfair that these two forms of heating are unregulated, surely something can be done?
    • Essgeebee
    • By Essgeebee 6th Aug 08, 1:50 AM
    • 16 Posts
    • 6 Thanks
    Essgeebee
    • #4
    • 6th Aug 08, 1:50 AM
    Negotiate with your oil supplier
    • #4
    • 6th Aug 08, 1:50 AM
    Heating oil has more than doubled in the last year and when there is no alternative to switch to, you're caught by the short and curlies. :confused:

    It's worth looking at oil prices in your area before placing an order for heating oil. Sites like Boilerjuice.com will give you the lowest price in a given area (but not the supplier name). I've used that info to haggle with my regular supplier. So far, they have always matched the Boilerjuice quote and I've saved about Ł50 a fill. A few pence per litre discount makes a big difference when you're filling a tank of 1000 litres or more.
    Last edited by MSE Archna; 12-08-2008 at 1:00 AM.
    • hillbilly5
    • By hillbilly5 6th Aug 08, 3:55 AM
    • 70 Posts
    • 27 Thanks
    hillbilly5
    • #5
    • 6th Aug 08, 3:55 AM
    Savings when buying heating oil.
    • #5
    • 6th Aug 08, 3:55 AM
    I run an oil heating syndicate/buying group for my local village. Basically once a month I will place an order of heating oil for anyone who needs oil. By co-ordinating our orders together, the suppliers are able to offer us a discount because rather than sending lorries to the village randomly when an individual phones an order through, they can co-ordinate the deliveries to be done on a set day delivering to all those in the village who ordered - thereby also helping to save the suppliers costs too.
    I do not charge for my services - the only 'perk' is that I can also get my heating oil at a discounted price too! I do not pay for my phone calls so it also costs me nothing extra either.
    So, anyone in the village who needs oil and wants to get a discount will ring me with their requirements by the last day of the month. On the 1st I ring around about 5 or 6 local suppliers and play them off against one another to get the very best possible price. Once I have negotiated a good price - I contact the members who wish to purchase oil with details of whom to place the order with and they then place their order direct with the supplier - I handle none of the payments thereby offering total security for the buyer.
    The best discounts are available on orders that are at least 7500L - however we are a small village and often our orders are only 2000-3000L. Even so, we have achieved considerable savings. On 1st August the cheapest price we were able to get was 53.45p per litre which was a fantastic price. Bearing in mind that if you would only usually buy 500L, teaming up with others (even just your next door neighbour) to make a larger order will achieve savings. If you only save 1p per litre, on an order of 500L, that means an extra Ł5 in YOUR pocket rather than someone else's!
    Last edited by MSE Archna; 12-08-2008 at 1:01 AM.
  • Squeekyclean
    • #6
    • 6th Aug 08, 6:03 AM
    Savings on Propane 47kg
    • #6
    • 6th Aug 08, 6:03 AM
    I use 47kg bottles of propane for my heating system, not through choice, this was the system that the previous owner installed.
    Most of the other houses in the area have electric white meter storage heaters.

    When I first bought these bottles they were fairly cheap but our suppliers seemed to hike the price up every time we ordered and not just in pence, It went up a couple of pounds every two weeks.

    We only use the heating six or seven months of the year so the bills are way below what we would be paying if using the storage heaters.

    I have asked about any grants available to get connected to the local gas supply because the pipe is only 100 yards from the house but costs are in the thousands.
    As far as I can find out no grants or help available so total costs would be down to me.

    I was told by one gas company that once I paid to get a pipe installed that anyone could jump onto the supply for only Ł250, meaning I would be paying for everyone else.

    As most of my neighbours are pensioners there is no way all of them could afford to come in with me although some have said that they would.

    Anyway, for anyone wanting to find the best deal on propane gas bottles the best idea is to shop around, forget the big bottle companies, I would try builders merchants.

    A lot of these merchants supply to tradespeople and the cost per bottle is usually much lower, I usually make a saving of between Ł10 - Ł12 per bottle.
    Some places also discount if you tell them it's for a heating system.
    Hope this helps.
    Mortgage FREE as of March 2015
    Cash Prize Win - Ł2000 in TV competition - WOW
    Reclaimed Ł5872.50 in credit card & bank charges
  • puppypower
    • #7
    • 6th Aug 08, 7:54 AM
    Use of Off Peak Electricity and a timed immersion heater
    • #7
    • 6th Aug 08, 7:54 AM
    I recently moved into a village house that once had storage heaters installed (and so already had a dual tariff electricity meter) - with an oil based central heating system and rising oil prices I had a 24 hour timer installed on my immersion heater to heat hot water during the early hours of the morning (i.e. off peak) and save on burning oil to heat water throughout the year. It seems to work!

    Obviously other tips would be to make sure your heating boiler is regularly serviced to ensure it's running at peak efficiency, bleeding your radiators and turning your thermostat down by a degree or so. I've also put reflectors behind the radiators mounted on outside walls (available from DIY shops). It's also worth reviewing your central heating controller timings etc. - altering them with your lifestyle (weekends and holidays etc..) and the seasons.
  • manc.girl
    • #8
    • 6th Aug 08, 8:31 AM
    Oil or gas
    • #8
    • 6th Aug 08, 8:31 AM
    We are experiencing the highest price for domestic fuel. Does anyone know how oil compares against gas? My dilema is this: our oil boiler is due to be replaced. Do we take the plunge and switch to gas (of which there is none presently in the house, but it is in the road) or buy a new replacement oil boiler?
  • davywz
    • #9
    • 6th Aug 08, 8:33 AM
    Cheaper LPG
    • #9
    • 6th Aug 08, 8:33 AM
    I don't know of any easy way to achieve cheaper LPG. The main problem in this area is that each company requires you to use their bulk tank and will not fill one belonging to a competitor.
    A few years ago I contacted my LPG company to tell them I was going to change suppliers as the price I was quoted from another company would generate savings after 18 months even if I had to pay the installation charge for the new tank. As it was that was going to be waived.
    The result was that my supplier offered to put me on the new customer rate which cut my price from 27p per litre to 18.95p per litre. The new deal also included an increase cap so several years down the line I'm still not paying as much as I was before my threat to change. Having said that LPG for central heating is worryingly expensive in the winter months.
    It'll be interesting to see what happens when my current capped contract runs out later this year.
  • norangeduck
    Ask for Calor Home heat when using 47kg,you need to buy at least two at a time,its a lot cheaper.
    Originally posted by chubbybrown4real
    Hi I use lpg 47kg bottles (in fact have a delivery today!) - can you tell me some more about this calor home heat?
    I didnt think there was anyway to save money on lpg, I usually just phone up national hotline and order!
    thanks
    • matt_outandabout
    • By matt_outandabout 6th Aug 08, 8:52 AM
    • 19 Posts
    • 37 Thanks
    matt_outandabout
    Remember that efficiency is they key - the cost of insulation is low at the moment, and as fuel prices rise it becomes even more cost effective.

    So in order:

    Draught proof everywhere - doors, windows, floors, skirtings, cracks in walls and ceilings etc. Be very fussy. The average old house has 20-24 Air Changes per Hour (20-24m3/hr/50pa) - new ones are built to 10ACH, and in Germany they regularly build to 1-3ACH! I found that in an old house, the area behind my kitchen cabinets was a howling gale - a few sheets of lining paper taped on the walls/floor soon solved that.

    Reflectors behind any radiator on an external wall.

    If you also have an open fire, block it up and use a modern clean burn biomass (wood)stove (or your central heating)- you will loose (on average) more heat up an open chimney that you would gain through lighting a fire in the evening....

    Is your attic/roof insulated? You should have at least 30cm of insulation - that seems a lot, but it works. Most DIY chains now do 2for1 deals on insulation as the energy companies subsidise the cost to meet their EU obligations. Do be aware that you get what you pay for - the cheapest glassfibre insulation won't last for long before it all starts compressing down and loosing its insulation. Many natural insulations (hemp, sheepswool) or new recycled plastic insulation mats hold thier depth for longer and out-perform cheap insulation. Avoid the thin multilayer foils - they do not work and are currently the centre of a lot of controversy in the construction industry.

    Are your floors insulated? If you can get in a cellar/floor space, get some insulation in there. To avoid damp issues, make sure it is well ventilated and use a hygroscopic insulation - a Hemp or Sheepswool is ideal. Solid floors can be insulated, but its a bigger job, probably involving a new floor/slab ebing laid.

    Double glazing - get as good as you can. Shut your (heavy & insulated) curtains on cold nights, or leave them shut on cold days if you are at work.

    Insulate your walls - cavity walls definitely as you get a grant, solid walls can also be insulated very well externally (simpler and cheaper) or internally (get a company that knows what they are doing). No grants for solid walls (despite most houses being so - are you listening government?). Insulating your walls usually has a faster 'payback' than double glazing according to the Energy Savings Trust!

    Fit good thermostatic valves on your radiators, and use them to control heat levels to 18*. Turning up a thermostatic valve does not mean you heat up quicker! Make sure your system and boiler are flushed, serviced and working as best they can.

    Some other ideas

    Big garden plants/shrubs/trees can cut the average windspeed around your house, so saving heat loss - but try to get deciduous varieties, so that you are shaded in summer and have the winter sun 'passively' heat you. Think 'microclimate'.

    Garages/greenhouses/lean-to sheds can all reduce heat loss, and can provide a simple way to add extra insulation to an area of wall - for example, I just insulated my fathers house wall, from inside the garage, using polystyrene for less than Ł10.

    While I am not a huge fan of renewable energy, do consider:

    Solar (water) panels are now very cost effective and make a real difference. Visit Navitron.org.uk for some very good prices, and the average plumber can fit them. Many of the national companies will over-charge you for the same product.

    Ground source heat pumps or (better) water source heat pumps are brilliant, but only if mains gas is not available. They are damn expensive though.....

    And do have a good root through the energy saving trusts pages as they have some practical guides to all of this.

    Some links to help:

    http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/uploads/documents/housingbuildings/CE138%20-%20energy%20efficient%20historic%20homes%20-%20case%20studies.pdf

    http://www.energysavingtrust.org.uk/...gs_4_01_08.pdf

    https://www.greensteps.co.uk/nottinghill/

    www.parityprojects.com

    http://www.natural-building.co.uk/PD...ies/Oakley.pdf

    http://www.aecb.net/


    Matt
    (sustainable building consultant)
    (damn, I should charge you lot! )
    Last edited by MSE Archna; 12-08-2008 at 1:02 AM.
  • treefrogbandit
    Switch to Biomass!!
    If you do a basic calorific value conversion from fuel oil to wood chip (ignoring boiler efficiencies for the moment) 60p/litre is the equivalent of around Ł200/tonne for dry wood chip (more than double the current market price of around Ł80/tonne ).

    You can get grants to help you install the new system see http://www.biomassenergycentre.org.uk for more details- it's the national hub for biomass technical information (run by the forestry commission)

    Hope this helps!

    Treefrogbandit
  • bracken
    Biomass very expensive to install
    If you do a basic calorific value conversion from fuel oil to wood chip (ignoring boiler efficiencies for the moment) 60p/litre is the equivalent of around Ł200/tonne for dry wood chip (more than double the current market price of around Ł80/tonne ).

    You can get grants to help you install the new system see http://www.biomassenergycentre.org.uk for more details- it's the national hub for biomass technical information (run by the forestry commission)

    Hope this helps!

    Treefrogbandit
    Originally posted by treefrogbandit

    Hello, I do not usually bother to post but feel quite strongly that this needs answering. WE need a new boiler and have spent the last 3 months investigating and getting quotes for biomass and also wood boilers. Also looked at Air source and ground source heat pumps( about Ł25k with a borehole!) but I have read that they do not keep either the house or hot water very hot so really should be used alongside eg biomass so no good for us even if we had the funding.

    Anyway besides the fact we are reasonable at DIY and can do most of the work ourselves thereby reducing the costs the cheapest we can get a woodfired ( not as good as pellets!) boiler installed is around Ł8000. This includes us getting a grant! We would also have to completely re-plumb our central heating system ( further increasing costs) so while I love the idea of biomass it is not yet a real alternative for normal people who do not earn large amounts of cash. It would also take us at least 4 years to pay for it self and thats if the price of oil goes up to Ł1 a Litre which hopefully it wont. In the end we are going to have to replace with an oil fired boiler costing around Ł2.5k including fitting but very efficient one.

    I am interested in trying running on biodeisel tho. Has/does anyone know how to do this. Our old boiler has a leak but I am considering keeping it and installing in a shed and trying it out running on biodeisel to see what happens. After all its pretty easy to make biodeisel and I have heard there are people collecting Waste oil and using this to run heating systems.

    Also just for info: my investigations over the last few months turned up the fact that in the USA they have waste oil fired heating which is often used to back up another boiler system.

    Anyway no idea if this is useful but hope it may help someone.

    Take care
    Bracken
  • sailopio
    heatingoil.co.uk
    I have been checking heating oil prices for the last few days, my normal suppliers quoting between 61 - 63p per litre plus vat for 1500 litres. I also tried boiler juice but as usual they where top price, I tried heatingoil.co.uk who last week quoted 59p yesterday they quoted 54.9p for delivery before next Tuesday. This is a fantastic saving also includes VAT. The only downside is that you have to pay in advance but I paid with my Tesco credit card so will get club points and still not have to pay until next month.
  • veritymeredith
    Reducing oil usage with an Aga or Rayburn
    If you have an Aga or Rayburn running on oil and would like to reduce your oil consumption then fit a snugburner. The snugburner is a boiler that lets you control when you want to use the cooker rather then having it ticking over all the time thus saving money. There is only one company who supplies the snugburner and only likes to sell them to plumbers who are familiar with them. They cost around Ł1800 to buy and install. Take a look at their website for technical info. Hope this helps.
    • the laughing cow
    • By the laughing cow 6th Aug 08, 10:58 AM
    • 14 Posts
    • 1 Thanks
    the laughing cow
    cheap electricity
    I have no gas in my area so changed from electric storage heating(had to be a long range weather forecaster) to an electric boiler with conventional radiators then switch to scottish hydro/southern electrics economy 10 tarrif which gives complete half price electricity for the whole house and not just the heating and hot water. half price times are,

    4.30am-7.30am
    1.30pm-4.30pm
    8.30pm-12.30am

    These times may very slightly
  • Retiredgasman
    Don't loose sight of the basics
    A bit cryptic as a heading BUT most people say they are getting cheaper gas or whatever and nevr grasp the fundamentals Gas is around 2.3p/kwhr (mine hasn't gone up yet) Electric is around 7p/kwhr, LPG is what we used to call a 'dump fuel' when I worked in the business is a residue from refining crude oil ergi it's usually around 7p/kwhr (same as electric) smokeless coal is approx 2.9p/kwhr -- it's a bit like driving your car, if you see the fuel advertised for xp/litre in one garage but it was at Yp/gallon in another how do you judge - me I've just filled my solid fuel bunkers up - sort of capping at +10% against mains gas.
    • klaatu
    • By klaatu 6th Aug 08, 11:25 AM
    • 140 Posts
    • 42 Thanks
    klaatu
    He fitted a magnetic device from
    Originally posted by GolfingMonk
    You're not allowed to promote your own web site here, Mr McTaggart.
    • poohbear59
    • By poohbear59 6th Aug 08, 11:49 AM
    • 4,820 Posts
    • 55,754 Thanks
    poohbear59
    I found that lpg 47kg bottles were becoming really pricy so I asked around at static caravan sites and I now buy from them at a much reduced rate than I could buy from my local supplier, probably because they buy in bulk.

    We heat with oil and wood. We have an equaliser which means that we can heat the water using our wood burner stove but when that goes out overnight or at this time of the year when we don't want room heating the oil kicks in. We scavange for wood a lot of the time (wth land owner's pemission) and that then reduces the need for the oil boiler to be on.

    We are busy building a new house and have found that because we don't have space for a header tank we can't have the wood and oil system linked together. We have been advised that a pressurised system is more fuel efficient and will reduce the amount of oil we use compared to an open system.

    When buying oil we wait until a few people in the village need oil and then I ring around to get the best price. As was mentioned before, an order for 1500 litres can save quite a few pence per litre, compared to the price for 500 litres.
    • Middlers
    • By Middlers 6th Aug 08, 12:14 PM
    • 494 Posts
    • 187 Thanks
    Middlers
    Every year I forget to check the oil and then incur the wrath of she who must be obeyed as we have to survive a few days without heating. I know I can have regulated deliveries and devices which warn etc but wouldn't it be good if we could just pop down the local shop and buy a few litres to tide us over until the delivery arrives?
    Middlers
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