Electric cars

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  • AdrianC
    AdrianC Posts: 42,189 Forumite
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    NigeWick wrote: »
    You, you mean you don't believe Mazda will have a range of BEVs by 2100?!
    It's quite a different meaning if you include the full sentence, y'know.
  • AnotherJoe
    AnotherJoe Posts: 19,622 Forumite
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    edited 13 February 2018 at 11:01AM
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    AdrianC wrote: »
    Depends entirely on the battery capacity, of course.

    A non-plugin Prius has a 6.5kWh battery. A plugin Prius has a 25kWh battery. Toyota claim 39 mile range from the plugin. They make no claims on the range from the non-plugin, but assuming it consumes power at the same rate, that'd be about 10 miles range at most.

    Those numbers can't be correct, certainly not the 25kWh one, because with that size of battery it ought to be doing double that mileage.

    And a quick google seems to show this, for example, from a write up at launch in November

    Headlines for the new plug-in are a bigger battery and a new two-motor drive system. The doubling of the rear-mounted battery power to 8.8kWh

    EDIT: Sorry didnt realise this mistake had been spotted and corrected earlier.
  • NigeWick
    NigeWick Posts: 2,715 Forumite
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    Coastalwatch wrote: »
    Not sure if I'm posting this on the correct board but have struggled to find anything more appropriate. I've an ageing deisel powered Ford Focus(ten years 75k miles) which has been brilliant but am thinking to replace. Electric(second hand) seems a possible choice especially as we have two vehicles, so can use the other for any long distances. We are retired with a mix of local journeys for school run etc and longer distances for holidays etc. I'm also keen on the idea of being self sufficient in generating electricity and considering combining the two. Our bungalow has roof of some 50 sq metres with a 22 degree pitch and being 20 degrees east of south facing. I'm thinking of filling the entire roof with panels in order to generate the max I can. On a good day in summer it could return 35kwh so I don't see a problem in supplying houehold needs(7k/day) and keeping the EV topped up. Am seeking quotations for systems of 4k only and the max that can be acheived also. Presumably I'd still get the FIT and export returns on the larger system so it would appear to me to be a sound financial investment. Am I looking through rose tinted glasses?
    You should soon be able to pick up a 30kWh Nissan Leaf for a good price as the 2018 version takes hold. Taking it steady, mine will do 110 - 120 miles of mixed driving in the summer and 90 in the freezing weather we've been having because the heater takes a bit even when stationary.

    As to solar, you'd have to look at HMGov Plc's web site to get the current FiT which won't be a lot. I'm getting a Tesla Powerwall 2 and Zappi charger next month so that I keep maximum generated in house. FiT only goes up to a 4kWh system and you'll also need your local DNO's approval to go above that. I'm having another couple of 300W panels added to my system due to the way they assess VAT on Powerwalls, 20% without additional PV or 5% with. Bit of a no brainer really.

    Bought outright, without my FiT I believe the 4kW system would take 10 years to pay for itself, same for the Powerwall. The Zappi charger should take a bit less as there's a government grant to help pay for it.
    The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye; the more light you pour upon it, the more it will contract.
    Oliver Wendell Holmes
  • NigeWick
    NigeWick Posts: 2,715 Forumite
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    AdrianC wrote: »
    It's quite a different meaning if you include the full sentence, y'know.
    Elon's great 'n' all but he hasn't been deified, yet.
    The mind of the bigot is like the pupil of the eye; the more light you pour upon it, the more it will contract.
    Oliver Wendell Holmes
  • AnotherJoe
    AnotherJoe Posts: 19,622 Forumite
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    edited 13 February 2018 at 11:02AM
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    AdrianC wrote: »
    I'm working on the basis that Toyota know.

    Battery capacity
    https://www.toyota.co.uk/car-configurator/prius#carconfig/engine_grades/
    https://www.toyota.co.uk/car-configurator/prius-plug-in#carconfig/engine_grades/
    Click on "Engines", "View All Features", then open up the "Engine" tab and look at the last line for battery capacities.

    Range is about half-way down...
    https://www.toyota.co.uk/new-cars/prius-plugin/index.json

    That is Amp Hours, not kilowatt hours. They are not the same.

    BMW are the oniy other manufacturer to use this metric , they quoted the original i3 as "60" but that is amp hours and actually it works out as about an 18kWh battery. So if the same ratio applies to Toyota, divide by 3 gets you to 8 kWh which is what the review I quoted in the thread above says.

    EDIT: Sorry didnt realise this mistake had been spotted and corrected earlier.
  • AnotherJoe
    AnotherJoe Posts: 19,622 Forumite
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    NigeWick wrote: »
    You should soon be able to pick up a 30kWh Nissan Leaf for a good price as the 2018 version takes hold. Taking it steady, mine will do 110 - 120 miles of mixed driving in the summer and 90 in the freezing weather we've been having because the heater takes a bit even when stationary.


    Its not the heater. You'd find pretty much the same range loss if the heater was off. There is a slight additional loss due to the fact you are using the heater but the bottom line is, in cold weather the battery is less efficient and the range drops. For example in my Soul Ev it will show what the range is with and without heater and heater usually is oniy about 5 to 6 miles but the base range will change depending upon the external temperature.

    Most EV drivers report at least a 20% drop from say 15 deg C to 0 dec C. My Soul Ev is currentiy doing about 100 miles, in summer I expect 120. The other factor is in wet weather the range drops a bit due to rolling resistance increasing and that's obviously more common in winter than summer.
  • zeupater
    zeupater Posts: 5,355 Forumite
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    NigeWick wrote: »
    ... FiT only goes up to a 4kWh system ....
    Hi

    ?? <Cough> .... ;)

    Solar PV banding under the FiT scheme runs all the way up to 5MWp ... all (non stand-alone) newly installed systems <10kWp are eligible to attract the same FiT rate, depending on energy efficiency ... FiT Tariffs


    HTH
    Z
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    B)
  • zeupater
    zeupater Posts: 5,355 Forumite
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    AnotherJoe wrote: »
    Its not the heater. You'd find pretty much the same range loss if the heater was off. There is a slight additional loss due to the fact you are using the heater but the bottom line is, in cold weather the battery is less efficient and the range drops. For example in my Soul Ev it will show what the range is with and without heater and heater usually is oniy about 5 to 6 miles but the base range will change depending upon the external temperature.

    Most EV drivers report at least a 20% drop from say 15 deg C to 0 dec C. My Soul Ev is currentiy doing about 100 miles, in summer I expect 120. The other factor is in wet weather the range drops a bit due to rolling resistance increasing and that's obviously more common in winter than summer.
    Hi

    Some manufacturers are building a small heater unit into(/around) the battery pack to help with cold weather performance ..

    HTH
    Z
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    B)
  • IanMSpencer
    IanMSpencer Posts: 1,517 Forumite
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    zeupater wrote: »
    Hi

    ?? <Cough> .... ;)

    Solar PV banding under the FiT scheme runs all the way up to 5MWp ... all (non stand-alone) newly installed systems <10kWp are eligible to attract the same FiT rate, depending on energy efficiency ... FiT Tariffs


    HTH
    Z
    We looked at putting an 8kW roof panel on back in the days of the original tariffs, I think there was something like a 10% reduction in rates. Unfortunately our roof was a couple of metres short on width and about a foot short on height to fit them.
  • zeupater
    zeupater Posts: 5,355 Forumite
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    IanMSpencer wrote: »
    We looked at putting an 8kW roof panel on back in the days of the original tariffs, I think there was something like a 10% reduction in rates. Unfortunately our roof was a couple of metres short on width and about a foot short on height to fit them.
    Hi

    They 'played around' with the tariff scheme some time ago when the rate of success being delivered by the scheme started to make [STRIKE]nu[/STRIKE] .. certain other technology support schemes look embarrassingly expensive at a politically sensitive time ... the <4kWp & the 4-10kWp bands still exist, but they now both pay the same rate - the tariff table in the link provided shows all of the rates which apply according to installation date, so the %age difference between the bands can be calculated ...

    HTH
    Z
    "We are what we repeatedly do, excellence then is not an act, but a habit. " ...... Aristotle
    B)
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