Putting home into family trust to avoid nursing home fees

Torry_Quine · 8 September 2012 at 6:25PM

Mojisola wrote: »

That's a crass statement!

I have spent a good few years caring for my parents despite my own health problems and the effects it has had on our family life and income.

I am now visiting care homes because it looks as if my father won't be able to come home after he leaves hospital. He needs a level of care we can't provide at home. There's no way we are "dumping" him anywhere - we are trying to find somewhere that can meet his needs which is the over-riding factor.

It does annoy me when people use phrases like these. When my relative needed to go into a care home she definitely wasn't dumped and in fact the doctors never even suggested we care for them at home.

seven-day-weekend wrote: »

People from your own church would probably visit and /or take you to church MC. I know this is what happens in my church.

The local church hold a service every month in the home my relative is in and visit regularly.

[Deleted User] · 8 September 2012 at 6:58PM

Bogof_Babe wrote: »

All very well implying that people in care homes should be being cared for by their families. Medical conditions apart, how is this possible where the (usually) elderly person lives in a one bedroomed flat and needs 24-hour care, or where the family live a long way away and cannot re-locate due to work commitments?

Or where there are rowdy teenagers living in the family home, and only one living room.

Or where a husband/wife has never got on with the inlaw concerned - hardly fair to inflict that on your partner.

Retirement homes are the next step from sheltered accommodation, and usually the occupants are perfectly able to complain loudly if something isn't right.

Adults with dementia can be impossible for family to care for, especially if there is only one son or daughter prepared to take the responsibility on.

Nursing homes have doctors and nurses dropping in almost daily, as well as the medically qualified staff in residence, and will soon flag up if any abuse is evident.

I am sorry for anyone who has not had a good experience in one of these places, but I'd be very surprised if this is common. Care homes are businesses and it is in their interests to provide a good service.

Well said.

The circumstances as to why people go into care are too numerous to even begin to list. But usually it is for either social or medical reasons, or both.

One reason particularly can be that relatives are simply unable to safely care for the person. And who cares for the carers? For anyone who has done it, including me, we already know that this is a task that will only ever get worse. It cannot be equated to childcare - though many ignorant employers feel it's the same, as does existing legislation. Children grow up and become less dependent. Adults in needing care grow more dependent.

Many people have already done a stint of caring, including giving up jobs and their own lives BEFORE circumstances forced the care home option upon them. Many have already paid a heavy price both financally and in terms of their own relationships and health. But the true cost remains under the radar because the subject is simply not kept prominently in the public eye.

Despite all the mention here about people being 'dumped' in care homes, it is not easy to simply oust someone from their home (owned or rented) rock up at a care home and leave them there.

Dumped in care homes usually means the person has been placed there, either by the family, well meaning or otherwise, or by the authorities - and then abandoned - no visits etc...

If the governments over the years actually looked at how much carers already save them, and decided to throw money at carers the way they do at foreign aid, perhaps more people would be able to care for a loved one. But sadly when that care is required, it's usually at a time when those potentially able to do so, and willing, cannot, because of their own existing financial commitments.

There are of course those who want to do nothing and pay nothing, but in terms of more familes caring for their loved ones, there has to be ways found to practically support them in this, not lip service, but actual hands on help and support and it needs to be made much more financially viable.

Errata · 8 September 2012 at 7:02PM

One reason particularly can be that relatives are simply unable to safely care for the person

Indeed, and this applies to 70, 80, 90 year old spouses as well as children in their 70's.

pollypenny · 8 September 2012 at 7:27PM

we considered bringing my father to live with us. However, he'd have been bored stiff, alone in the house all day, as he had very limited mobility.

The residential home, near his home was the best bet. we visited every 3 weeks and friends visited in between.

BTW: our children don't expect anything. If there's something left all well and good, if not tough! We've given them a far better start in life than our parents were able to do for us.

gingerfox · 8 September 2012 at 8:57PM

Errata wrote: »

Those of you who have found a satisfactory care home are fortunate, many don't and the sub-optimal care that's uncovered by the media and in the courts is merely the tip of the iceberg.
Vanishingly few know if the care at their closest residental home is of an acceptable standaed, most like to believe it is.
If you have a POV on care quality you can make it known here http://www.cqc.org.uk/public/news/send-us-your-views-our-proposals-our-new-strategy

My mother has been in care for a year now and the point you make worries me sick. I've already moved her to what I think is a better home than the first one we tried. I think the staff are (mostly) caring and kind, however, they are too few in number and can barely look after the residents' many and diverse needs. Tonight when I arrived, my mother's foot had been trapped under a table, such was the haste of the carer who had returned her from the bathroom. It wasn't deliberate, but nevertheless left her in in a lot of pain, and had I not visited could have ended badly.

I don't believe any of the staff I've met are cruel, but then I would never know if any were, and this haunts me.

John_Pierpoint · 9 September 2012 at 3:56AM

Torry_Quine wrote: »

I When my relative needed to go into a care home she definitely wasn't dumped and in fact the doctors never even suggested we care for them at home.
.

When my mother had a stroke and ended up in hospital, virtually the first question I was asked was: "Is she self funding?" (ie does she own her own home?).
As soon as it was established she was "a self funder" - I was given a glossy brochure and sent out on a tour of places I did not really know existed.
If I was a Martian, I would not have sent back good reports of about the earthlings' treatment of dying.

So I reported back to the hospital that when they had given my mother some rehabilitation, they could discharge her back to her own home.
We the family would make arrangements to meet her needs.

The professionals really did not like that decision. They were having nightmares I think about: a confused incontinent old woman going out to play with the traffic.
Much better to have them tucked up in something akin to a boarding school.

I still remember the reaction of the head "professional".

Oh some families think they can do this - believe me: It never works.

margaretclare · 9 September 2012 at 9:56AM

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

When my mother had a stroke and ended up in hospital, virtually the first question I was asked was: "Is she self funding?" (ie does she own her own home?).
As soon as it was established she was "a self funder" - I was given a glossy brochure and sent out on a tour of places I did not really know existed.
If I was a Martian, I would not have sent back good reports of about the earthlings' treatment of dying.

So I reported back to the hospital that when they had given my mother some rehabilitation, they could discharge her back to her own home.
We the family would make arrangements to meet her needs.

The professionals really did not like that decision. They were having nightmares I think about: a confused incontinent old woman going out to play with the traffic.
Much better to have them tucked up in something akin to a boarding school.

I still remember the reaction of the head "professional".

Oh some families think they can do this - believe me: It never works.

I don't know what kind of a stroke unit your mother was admitted to, but our local one has had excellent reports. Yes, rehabilitation is the key. Having a stroke isn't necessarily the end of the line. http://www.echo-news.co.uk/news/9902011.Southend_Hospital_s_stroke_unit_is_one_of_best_in_region

gingerfox · 9 September 2012 at 11:08AM

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

When my mother had a stroke and ended up in hospital, virtually the first question I was asked was: "Is she self funding?" (ie does she own her own home?).
As soon as it was established she was "a self funder" - I was given a glossy brochure and sent out on a tour of places I did not really know existed.
If I was a Martian, I would not have sent back good reports of about the earthlings' treatment of dying.

So I reported back to the hospital that when they had given my mother some rehabilitation, they could discharge her back to her own home.
We the family would make arrangements to meet her needs.

The professionals really did not like that decision. They were having nightmares I think about: a confused incontinent old woman going out to play with the traffic.
Much better to have them tucked up in something akin to a boarding school.

I still remember the reaction of the head "professional".

Oh some families think they can do this - believe me: It never works.

Unfortunately yours isn't the only hospital with this attitude (unless it's the same one as ours). My experience was utterly dismal, and at a time when I most needed good quality help and advice, and a bit of empathy too would have been nice.

Did your mother get some rehab?

Torry_Quine · 9 September 2012 at 10:43PM

John_Pierpoint wrote: »

When my mother had a stroke and ended up in hospital, virtually the first question I was asked was: "Is she self funding?" (ie does she own her own home?).
As soon as it was established she was "a self funder" - I was given a glossy brochure and sent out on a tour of places I did not really know existed.
If I was a Martian, I would not have sent back good reports of about the earthlings' treatment of dying.

So I reported back to the hospital that when they had given my mother some rehabilitation, they could discharge her back to her own home.
We the family would make arrangements to meet her needs.

The professionals really did not like that decision. They were having nightmares I think about: a confused incontinent old woman going out to play with the traffic.
Much better to have them tucked up in something akin to a boarding school.

I still remember the reaction of the head "professional".

Oh some families think they can do this - believe me: It never works.

My relative was initially in an acute ward and then in a rehabilitation ward where the decision was made that a care home was needed and until then would be moved to a long stay ward. We then went to look at the home our relative wanted and the matron visited to assess the care needs. We asked the home about the fees as we realised that my relative would be self-funding initially. Once a bed became available then her care manager (social worker) visited and only then was the question asked about the finances. The hospital staff never asked about any financial aspect.

John_Pierpoint · 10 September 2012 at 4:01PM

Well it was not Southend - on - Sea hospital, nearer Heathrow airport flight path in SW London.

Did you read the "Vox Pop" comments under the Echo article Margaret?

I cannot fairly say that two experiences of SW London (and a friend's report of Southend) make me an expert - perhaps I have been unlucky and I am prepared to acknowledge that finances are stretched and our resources are overloaded.

Putting home into family trust to avoid nursing home fees

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