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Appeal dismissed by IAS

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2456727

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  • Snakes_Belly
    Snakes_Belly Posts: 3,696 Forumite
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    edited 13 September 2017 at 1:47PM
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    I think that the land is leased to Excel. I saw some information online which indicated that there was a lease. Anyone can park there and it is motorists using the station and visitors to the Travelodge use the car park. Excel manage the parking at the fore of the Travelodge and have a few spaces at the rear on the Lower Station Car park which is a different operator and tariff. The visitors to the Travelodge are given a permit for a certain length of time but not all day which causes a few tickets to be issued. That's another story.

    http://www.jenics.com/pdf/jenics-travelodge-burton-update-2.pdf

    The image in the above link shows the rear of the Travelodge before Excel Parking operated there. That is the Lower Station Car Park and where one of Excel ticket machines is located obscured by the protrusions on the building. I wish I could upload the photographs I have taken.


    https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/ShowUserReviews-g504150-d3476957-r319883582-Travelodge_Burton_Upon_Trent_Central_Hotel-Burton_upon_Trent_Staffordshire_Engla.html

    Nolite te bast--des carborundorum.
  • Snakes_Belly
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    Just to update on this I have received a Notice of Intended Court Proceedings from Excel. They have not used the new protocols. I am intending writing back to suggest that they follow the protocols. My understanding is that I will be able to drag this out for at least another two months which will give me chance to prepare if I decide to go down that route.

    I would appreciate someone on the site taking a look at an image of a sign but am unsure of how to upload the image. Thank you.

    Nolite te bast--des carborundorum.
  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 37,655 Forumite
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    I would appreciate someone on the site taking a look at an image of a sign but am unsure of how to upload the image. Thank you.
    Host it on tinypic or somewhere similar and the post the url here.
  • KeithP
    KeithP Posts: 37,655 Forumite
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    Just to update on this I have received a Notice of Intended Court Proceedings from Excel. They have not used the new protocols. I am intending writing back to suggest that they follow the protocols. My understanding is that I will be able to drag this out for at least another two months which will give me chance to prepare if I decide to go down that route.

    There are several LBC replies around.

    Here's a recent one, which refers to the new protocols, linked from post #2 of the NEWBIES thread:

    forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php?p=73208118#post73208118
  • Snakes_Belly
    Snakes_Belly Posts: 3,696 Forumite
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    Thank you Keith. I will use that reply and modify it to my circumstances. Will try to upload the image.

    Nolite te bast--des carborundorum.
  • Snakes_Belly
    Snakes_Belly Posts: 3,696 Forumite
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    edited 23 October 2017 at 1:49PM
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    http://tinypic.com/usermedia.php?uo=NuVqmzAy%2FKxamMLsTdhWZIh4l5k2TGxc#.We3gV3mWyic


    The font that relates to the charges and the formation of the contract seems small to me.

    Nolite te bast--des carborundorum.
  • nosferatu1001
    nosferatu1001 Posts: 12,961 Forumite
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    Dont suggest, tell. they have no choice but to comply, otherwise you start building a case for a) the claim to be struck out and b) costs.
  • Umkomaas
    Umkomaas Posts: 41,357 Forumite
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    http://tinypic.com/usermedia.php?uo=NuVqmzAy%2FKxamMLsTdhWZIh4l5k2TGxc#.We3gV3mWyic


    The font that relates to the charges and the formation of the contract seems small to me.

    It’s something you would make of in a court case. You will also need to pray-in-aid the Supreme Court comments of what a clear signage looks like, especially the very clear, unmissable level of the parking charge in the event of breach.

    But keep this for Court, because nothing you can fire back to Excel will make any difference at this stage.
    Please note, we are not a legal advice forum. I personally don't get involved in critiquing court case Defences/Witness Statements, so unable to help on that front. Please don't ask. .

    I provide only my personal opinion, it is not a legal opinion, it is simply a personal one. I am not a lawyer.

    Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day; show him how to catch fish, and you feed him for a lifetime.

    Private Parking Firms - Killing the High Street
  • Snakes_Belly
    Snakes_Belly Posts: 3,696 Forumite
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    edited 24 October 2017 at 2:50PM
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    Your Ref:xxxxxxxxxxx

    Dear Sirs,

    I am in receipt of your Notice of Intended Court Proceedings of 12th October 2017.

    You must know that on 01 October 2017 a new protocol is applicable to debt claims. Since proceedings have not yet been issued, the new protocol clearly applies and must be complied with.

    Your letter lacks specificity and breaches both the requirements of the previously applicable Practice Direction - Pre-Action Conduct (paragraphs 6(a) and 6(c)) and the new Pre-Action Protocol for Debt Claims (paragraphs 3.1(a)-(d), 5.1 and 5.2. Please treat this letter as a formal request for all of the documents / information that the protocol now requires you to provide. You must not issue proceedings without complying with that protocol. I reserve the right to draw any failure of the Claimant to comply with the protocol to the attention of the court and to ask the court to stay the claim and order you to comply with its pre-action obligations, and when costs come to be considered.

    As a serial litigator you must surely be familiar with the requirements of both the Practice Direction applicable pre-1 October and the Protocol which applies thereafter. As you must know, the Practice Direction and Protocol bind all potential litigants, whatever the size or type of the claim. Its express purpose is to assist parties in understanding the claim and their respective positions in relation to it, to enable parties to take stock of their positions and to negotiate a settlement, or at least narrow the issues, without incurring the costs of court proceedings or using up valuable court time. It is astounding you are sending a consumer a notice of intending court proceedings in ignorance of the pre-existing Practice Direction and the new Protocol.

    Nobody, including you is immune from the requirements and obligations of the Practice Direction and now the Protocols.

    I require you to comply with its obligations by sending me the following information/documents:


    1) Is the claim for a contractual breach? If so, what is the date of the agreement? The names of the parties to it and provide to me a copy of that contract.

    2) Is the claim for trespass? If so, provide details.
    3). Provide me a copy of the contract with the landowner under which they assert authority to bring the claim, as required by the IPC code of practice section B, clause 1.1 “establishing yourself as the creditor”.
    4) Details of the signs displayed (size of sign, size of font, height at which displayed)
    5) Provide details of the original charge, and detail any interest and administrative or other charges added.

    6)Provide details of how the monies being charged arose and how they have been calculated.
    7) Provide a copy of the Information Sheet and the Reply Form.


    If you do not provide me with this information then I put you on notice that I will be relying on the cases of Webb Resolutions Ltd v Waller Needham & Green [2012] EWHC 3529 (Ch), Daejan Investments Limited v The Park West Club Limited (Part 20) – Buxton Associates [2003] EWHC 2872, Charles Church Developments Ltd v Stent Foundations Limited & Peter Dann Limited [2007] EWHC 855 in asking the court to impose sanctions on your client and to order a stay of the proceedings, pursuant to paragraphs 13 ,15(b) and (c) and 16 of the Practice Direction, as referred to in paragraph 7.2 of the Protocol.

    Until you have complied with its obligations and provided this information, I am unable to respond properly to the alleged claim and to consider my position in relation to it, and it is entirely premature (and a waste of costs and court time) for you to issue proceedings. Should you client do so, then I will seek an immediate stay pursuant to paragraph 15(b) of the Practice Direction and an order that this information is provided.


    Please note that I will only respond when you have complied with the Protocol. I will not respond to third party debt collectors so to engage them will be futile.

    Note also that I have discussed aspects of this matter with the Equality and Human Rights Commission and they are of the opinion that I may have a case of indirect discrimination against you. They have opened a case and are awaiting further information.

    I note your comments regarding my appeal to IAS. As I am sure you are aware that there is currently a PMB going through Parliament which will gain cross party support. Part of the reason for this is because IAS is considered unfit for purpose and I am sure that a County Court Judge will be very aware of this development.

    Should this matter be decided in the County Court I will be making a counter claim.

    Thanks for the sample letter responding to Excel who have not complied with the Protocols. I have adapted it somewhat and would be grateful if someone would kindly scan it over please. Thank you.
    I have deleted some of the requests for information. I was unsure whether to do this however as I have appealed to IAS some of that information is available to me already. I was not certain if I was starting from scratch again.
    Thanks for the use of this letter. I would not have been able to put anything together like that myself.





    Nolite te bast--des carborundorum.
  • nosferatu1001
    nosferatu1001 Posts: 12,961 Forumite
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    Have you talked to the EHRC?
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