Re wills and IHT on first death

joe134 · 16 November 2019 at 4:17AM

Hi Guys, don’t know if this is right thread to post this ?
I am going through my wife and my financial affairs to make it easier for my wife should I go first.
I have itemised all my bank a/cs and hers should it be vice versa, so she can just put her hand on them.
I don’t know whether she will try and obtain probate on her own, with the kids help, or get a solicitor or other? She says she would try herself ?
I have written everything to do in order of priority to be done, so nothing is missed out causing any problems.
Done a lot of reading up on it!
At present the house is mortgage free and in joint names,and we have approx £300k each in separate bank a/c’s, mostly cash isas and cash bank a/c’s.
No other investments and expensive items,and debt free.
As I understand the IHT rules, if I don’t exceed the £325k in cash in my name, then the house passes to the wife automatically and there should be no IHT to pay, and vice versa, although she has to notify Hmrc before probate is given for IHT purposes.
Is this correct ?

We have only written mirror wills from WHSmith, as I think they are ample for what seems to me to be a straight forward procedure ?
At death, all of my estate passes to her, and vice versa, no gifts etc.
Has anyone handled someone’s affairs with this type of will ?
I have lost a lot of friends lately who used solicitors to draw up wills, and will writers, and OH’s , not all,have had nothing but trouble,and long drawn out expensive experiences hence my WHSmith one.
Any advice would be truly appreciated.
I have not read one post that an executor has dealt with this type of will , or maybe it just wasn’t mentioned.

bigadaj · 16 November 2019 at 8:39AM

My understanding is that there's no iht between spouses so no concern there, and allowance on first death carries forward to the second death.

I'm no fan of solicitors but for a couple of hundred quid to a solicitor I think it's worthwhile getting a will done given there is six figures or more at stake. You don't need a will between spouses, but do for the second death to cover distribution to children, family, friends, charities etc

jamei305 · 16 November 2019 at 8:42AM

It doesn't sounds like the WHSmith will makes any provision for what happens if you both die at the same time, or within a short time of each other, for example in a traffic accident.

I assume you don't have any dependents otherwise this should worry you.

Tom99 · 16 November 2019 at 9:25AM

As said, no IHT no matter how much you own/leave to each other.
You say house in joint names but check it's joint tenants not tenants in common. You can do this by checking the Title Register, if it's held as tenants in common there will be the following restriction under Part B Proprietorship Register:

'RESTRICTION: No disposition by a sole proprietor of the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of the court.'

It's probably a good idea to leave a copy of the title with your will and other documents.
With regard to the will it's probably a minimum to say that if your wife dies before you your estate will go in equal shares to your children, same for your wife's will.

joe134 · 16 November 2019 at 10:14AM

Thanks for replies guys.
We do have children, grand children and great grand children.
Wouldn’t say they were dependents though?
The house is joint tenants, got the land registry title deed with the wills, deeds are with solicitors.
The bank accounts are not joint !
Trying to gather as much as possible to make life easier for wife if I go first.
I did know that the WHSmith wills made no provision of joint deaths, made these out a long while ago before we had as much money to leave.
When the last one dies, then kids/grandkids/great grandkids will get a percentage each of everything that’s left after disbursements etc, not equal parts.
That will be stipulated in the will new of the one of us that survives, providing we don’t go together!
Will get a solicitor to draw up new wills, have thought about it, hence this post.
The odds of going together are slim, but one never knows.
Thanks again.

zagfles · 16 November 2019 at 10:30AM

I've helped administer a couple of intestate estates where spouse inherited everything, and they were relatively easy. There was a lot of form filling - note you might have to fill in the IHT forms even if you're nowhere near the threshold, even if the spouse gets everything so there's nothing to pay, you still need to value all possessions etc. We just used rough estimates as clearly there was no way any IHT would be due. Probate done within a couple of months.

If you use a solicitor for probate it'll take longer, as they'll need to do everything by the book eg put an ad in the London Gazette for any debts etc, which isn't really necessary if you knew the deceased and are certain they didn't have any debts (or if you'll inherit it all anyway so it doesn't really matter).

Keep a record of any gifts etc above the relevant thresholds £250/£3000 etc, google them.

If you use a solicitor for the will DO NOT make them the executor, as they then have the monopoly and if they are expensive, slow etc there's nothing you can do. Make your spouse/close relative friend executor, they can always appoint a solicitor if they need to, they aren't forced to use a particular one.

Mojisola · 16 November 2019 at 11:02AM

If you employ a solicitor to do the work but stay as executors, the solicitors don't have to put an ad in the Gazette - that's a decision for the executors to make.

joe134 · 16 November 2019 at 11:57AM

zagfles wrote: »

I've helped administer a couple of intestate estates where spouse inherited everything, and they were relatively easy. There was a lot of form filling - note you might have to fill in the IHT forms even if you're nowhere near the threshold, even if the spouse gets everything so there's nothing to pay, you still need to value all possessions etc. We just used rough estimates as clearly there was no way any IHT would be due. Probate done within a couple of months.

If you use a solicitor for probate it'll take longer, as they'll need to do everything by the book eg put an ad in the London Gazette for any debts etc, which isn't really necessary if you knew the deceased and are certain they didn't have any debts (or if you'll inherit it all anyway so it doesn't really matter).

Keep a record of any gifts etc above the relevant thresholds £250/£3000 etc, google them.

If you use a solicitor for the will DO NOT make them the executor, as they then have the monopoly and if they are expensive, slow etc there's nothing you can do. Make your spouse/close relative friend executor, they can always appoint a solicitor if they need to, they aren't forced to use a particular one.

Thanks zagflies.
I reckoned on doing probate myself, not sure if wife would be able to, probably could with Son or Daughters help:rotfl:
Not exactly savvy with money, as I know to my cost !
Wife is first executor and only executor on whs wills ,as it was just a straight forward , everything goes to the other.
Making a new will will change that.

Would make Son second executor, he has lPA.
Have given lots of money to them over the years, all in the last 7.
Approx £50k+.
The house is circa £350k +-, so with money, roughy £950k
The house left to the kids should allow for IHT on second death, £175k each, after next year, if I’m correct, take it to near the £1 mil.???
Need to clarify how that works ?
Have to spend some on ourselves on things we don’t need:eek:
Don’t want to get involved with trusts etc.
Have find a good solicitor.

. :beer:

p00hsticks · 16 November 2019 at 12:09PM

You could have a look to see if you have a will aid solicitor near you - it's something solicitors do for free once a year in November in return for a donation to charity

https://www.willaid.org.uk/

joe134 · 16 November 2019 at 12:30PM

p00hsticks wrote: »

You could have a look to see if you have a will aid solicitor near you - it's something solicitors do for free once a year in November in return for a donation to charity

https://www.willaid.org.uk/

Hi thanks for that.
Read a long article about it yesterday, a thread on here about it.
Not exactly as it’s advertised, lot of people with bad experiences.
No such thing as a free lunch, or “ owt for nowt”
Not in my lifetime anyway
Will shop around.
It’s a lottery anyway, as I haven’t a clue what the going rate is for drawing up two mirror wills as discussed on here ?
Nothing to compare with, and don’t know anyone to recommend one, all my friends that used them are gone.
:beer::beer:

eskbanker · 16 November 2019 at 12:38PM

joe134 wrote: »

Hi Guys, don’t know if this is right thread to post this ?

There is a cheerily-titled Deaths, Funerals & Probate Board where wills and other associated matters are discussed regularly....

Re wills and IHT on first death

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