Denplan

dora37

Thanks for all the info Toothsmith - I will contact the private practice regarding the childrens scheme.

If they were registered privately and then went onto have orthodontic work, which as you say can be done on NHS, would they then have to change dentists? As I am pretty sure this practice is solely for private patients.

Toothsmith

dora37 wrote:

If they were registered privately and then went onto have orthodontic work, which as you say can be done on NHS, would they then have to change dentists? As I am pretty sure this practice is solely for private patients.

No - Orthodontics is a specialism within dentistry. The vast majority of orthodontics is provided on the NHS.

They will most likely refer a child needing orthodontics out to a specialist practice and that practice will be NHS.

It doesn't matter wher the child has been refered from. (Just like if you have an operation done privately, you can still see your NHS GP)

Even if they do orthodontics at the practice you go to, it too will most likely be NHS for kids. If it isn't, you are perfectly entitled to ask to be refered to an NHS orthodontist. That will not affect future care at that practice.

If the teeth are only slightly crooked, then it is possible that it could only be corrected privately, but then you have to ask yourself if it is really putting your kid through it at all for such a little change.

jap200

At the time of writing I am fuming, having just received a letter from our family dentist.

He says that as of 3rd July he will no longer be offering NHS treatment at all - even for children. He stopped offering NHS treatment for adults a year ago, but until now has agreed to see our three children on the NHS if we (i.e. both parents) go private.

Now the only option he is offering for the children is Denplan at a minimum cost of £7.50 a month for each child!! This is a whopping £22.50 a month for our three children - he is not even allowing us to 'pay as you go' for the same treatment!!

Well, we certainly don't have that sort of money 'spare' each month! Also, my children are all under 6 and have very good teeth, which we take particular care in looking after, so I resent paying for something that we are unlikely to use.

I phoned NHS direct, which is what you have to do now to find a new NHS dentist and they told me that there is not a single one taking on NHS patients within a 50 mile radius of where I live!!

I am at a loss for what to do - any suggestions gratefully received

Rikki

Will they not allow you to pay for each check up as you need it?

quickstepqueen

This seems to be happening far too frequently. I think it's a disgrace when you pay your National Insurance that your children cannot access free healthcare. I guess the only other option may be to source another private dentist who will allow you to pay as you go, but this really does stink!

If you do get anywhere please keep us posted.

hjb123

I think paying privately is quite a waste of money aswell to be honest! I am paying over £16 per month and my appointments are 6 monthly checkups - okay so cleaning, and fillings and everythings included but it seems so much to pay! Another thing they give discounts if there is more than one of you signed up in the same house but we havent done that - we are all with different dentists so dont know how that would work!

Toothsmith

jap200 wrote:

Also, my children are all under 6 and have very good teeth, which we take particular care in looking after, so I resent paying for something that we are unlikely to use.

By unlikely to 'Use' do you mean that your children won't be seeing the dentist at all?

I don't think that's what you mean.

The regulation changes of April 1st make it very difficult for a dentist to look after a specific list of patients. The contract is simply to provide an amount of NHS 'time' for which they will be awarded points, and if they get a target number of points, then their NHS money won't be cut next year.

Now that nobody is actually registered with an NHS dentist, who gets to see a dentist with an NHS contract can be a lot more closely controlled by the PCT (Primary Care Trust). They can now direct people with toothaches to any dentist with an NHS contract. The dentist is on very thin ice if he refuses to see a patient directed to him because he is 'saving' his points for the patients he has seen in the past (I.e your children).

Some dentists signed the new contract to'see how it goes'. Some (like myself) refused.

I would imagine most PCTs are still playing it very carefully, and not wanting to upset the dentists that have signed. Some will probably be exercising their new powers to impose patients on practices, and I would imagine that that is why your dentist is now baling out.

Now -back to your post.

A lot of people equate dental 'treatment' with having fillings.

You feel that if your children aren't having fillings, you're not getting your 'moneys worth'

Let me turn that around and ask you how much would it be worth to you to get your children through childhood without ever having a filling? Or if they do, the tiniest filling possible (In a tooth coloured material)?

That can now be done with good educational programs and good preventative dentistry.

The NHS is recommending yearly visits now for 'healthy' patients. This is so they can fit more people in with the NHS dentists they have.

Good preventative dentistry needs regular visits so that educational messages can be reinforced, and any traces of early decay can be acted upon before a filling is needed.

With moving away from the NHS, your dentist is probably going to improve these services more than he could provide on the NHS.

I too don't offer a fee-per-item scale for children. This is to get round this idea that if no fillings have been done, then nothing worth paying for has taken place.

Also, with Denplan, there is an insurance component so that if a child suffers a traumatic injury to a tooth (And one in six children do suffer some sort of tooth accident during their childhood) the costs of repair are covered.

If £22.50 a month is dear, imagine a bill for a couple of thousand for a broken tooth needing complex root treatments over several years, which can be necessary if a very young tooth with an open root is damaged.

I appreciate your anger at this. It is a terrible state of affairs, but it has been coming for a very long time. Dentists have been warning that the 'new contract' is a disaster waiting to happen. The waiting is just about over.

The bottom line is that NHS dental care in England is in terminal decline. If you want to travel 50 miles for what will be a very poor service dressed up as dentistry, that's up to you.

Or you could look at your other expenses and find the £22.50 for what should continue to be a good service for you and your kids.

If it isn't a good service, then look around, because within the private sector there should be good service somewhere close by.

frostyspice

Dental plan fees - £20-odd/month
Sky subs - £21/month (minimum)

Which is 'worth it'?

Which one is going to make you feel better when you've got toothache?

across

well i am in a right mess because of this dentist saga! i have changed dentist 3 times to keep going nhs and my latest one has gone private so i am on the waiting of 2 other dentists awaiting nhs treatment who both say a few months left on waiting list and i'm determined not to go to my now private dentist, this week however i havent been able to eat on the right side and as i couldnt get any nhs treatment anywhere i went to emergancy clinic thinking i just needed a refil on a back tooth and this way i'd get nhs, after having xray it turns out it was decaying underneath the filling for quite some time and that is why i or the dentist didnt pick up on it, i am shocked to say the least as i go religiously to dentist and brush my teeth about four times a day! but it was going on underneath so i guess i couldnt of prevented it, now they have drilled it out and put a dressing on it and told me to go to my dentist for either root treatment or extraction and i havent got an affordable dentist so dont know what to do? any ideas? the tooth is nagging me constantly but what kind of prices am i talking if i give in to private please help? thanks!

Toothsmith

across wrote:

after having xray it turns out it was decaying underneath the filling for quite some time and that is why i or the dentist didnt pick up on it, i am shocked to say the least as i go religiously to dentist and brush my teeth about four times a day! but it was going on underneath so i guess i couldnt of prevented it!

If the dentist who did the original filling had taken a bit more time over it, and removed all the decay, it wouldn't have got into that state.

Sometimes dentists make a choice to leave a little bit of decay as to remove it may well permanently harm the tooth, especially if the decay is getting very close to the nerve. A well sealed filling will often stop decay in it's tracks.

If this was the case, the dentist would probably have noted to keep a close eye on it with x-rays to check it had stopped. By moving dentists a lot, this information is lost, as dental notes rarely follow patients unless asked for specifically.

Trying to find a dentist when you have a problem is about the worst time to do it. You are at the mercy of whoever has time to see you, which needn't necessarily be the best dentist in the area.

Your best bet would be to go back to one of your previous dentists. You would at least have a record there. (Unless of course you made a bit of a scene when you left!;) )

As to how much, I have no idea.

There would be an initial inspection, any necessary x-rays and whatever treatment was needed. Just be sure to get a printed estimate, and discuss alternatives. There is rarely just one way to do something. Different options will cost different amounts.