Unwittingly signed up for a 12 month broadband contract with ISP

Popo_4

Trying to keep this factual but I am so livid that they can con a pensioner into these deals. Don’t know if I can mention the name of the ISP so I won’t just in case but you can probably work out who it is anyway.

My dad tried the one month free trial with an ISP.
After about 3 weeks, he phoned to cancel and was offered another month free. When asked the reason for cancelling, he said that he found it to be slow. He’s not particularly knowledgeable about the internet and didn’t realise that his pc is very old and not powerful which is why it is slow. The CSR he spoke to offered him a month free trial of broadband and told him he would be sent a modem. He had to cancel within a month and send back the broadband modem so as not to be charged for anything. The month is not yet complete but he has been billed for the first month as a broadband customer. The modem has not been installed because there is not enough memory on the pc to do this. Surely they can tell it hasn’t been used, yet they are still charging for this. :mad:

Dial up connection has not worked for about a week, presumably because they have transferred him to broadband.

The reason he phoned after 3 weeks to cancel was that he was going into hospital for surgery and was not sure he would be in a fit state to deal with this on his return home. From what I can work out it was during this time in hospital that he was supposed to cancel the “contract” and send back the broadband modem.

He uses the internet for occasional surfing but mainly for email, although he can’t even do that now since he doesn’t understand their email system (it won’t work with Outlook Express which is all he knows how to use, can’t even work out hotmail :rolleyes: ). So he hasn’t picked up his email from this ISP which I assume tells him the time period for cancelling has expired, he has now become a broadband customer etc. He is of the era who deals with signing bits of paper and letters to confirm contracts not telephone and email contracts.

We will be writing a letter to the ISP detailing the events to see if he can be let out of this contract due to being led to believe he would have a month free, but wondered if anyone had any advice or previous experience of being misled like this. I have had broadband since 2003 and didn’t realise the first time I signed up for it that it was a minimum 12 month contract. I find it very deceptive that ISPs rarely warn about this – I’ve changed BB providers twice since and have asked about the minimum contract only because I know about it now. The other beef is that this particular ISP have their call centre in India and it is incredibly difficult to understand what their staff are saying. Their accents are pronounced and despite us being Asian also and having visited India, it has been a struggle to communicate with the people in this call centre. Unfortunately I didn’t hear the conversation between the CSR and my father so I don’t know if this was the cause of the misunderstanding, or if the CSR really didn’t make it clear that it was a minimum contract with 7 day cooling off period. What my father told me afterwards about the conversation was exactly what he told the CSR and Senior CSR when he phoned to query the billing charge: he was offered a free broadband trial for 1 month; no charge if he cancels and sends back the modem before the month is up; no mention of minimum contract or cooling off period. Apparently he is now tied in for 12 months unless he pays a penalty fee of £280.

My opinion is that this CSR sneakily conned my father into agreeing to a broadband contract (for which the CSR probably received a bonus) without his realising what he was agreeing to. Apparently the conversation was not recorded so they have no record of what the CSR said to my dad to get him to agree to sign up for a broadband connection for a pc that has only 48MB of HDD:eek:! I just find it typical of a major company to screw an unfortunate man and claim he agreed to this. He has been well rewarded for his ignorance and inexperience with technology.

Wig

Ok first it is OK to name the company.

second you say we are still within the first broadband month? So first thing you have to do is return the modem ASAP by recorded special delivery (gauranteed next day delivery) Include a note to say you were given a free one month trial of broadband, and that you have decided because your computer is old, it is not suitable for the purpose.

Also point out that you have recieved a bill for this period which contradicts what you were told on the telephone, and that this mentions a 12 month contract (if it does) and tell them that you do not accept that any contract exists other than the one month free no obligation trial which you are by returning the modem within one month cancelling as per your agreement with customer services.

That is the first thing you have to do and you have to do it tomorrow morning.

After you have done this we can discuss the next action should they hypothetically decide to persue you for the money....i.e. we can discuss the possibility of making a small claim against the company, and tell you how to do it.

On this note, can I ask the MSE's what would be the nature of the claim against the ISP given that their hasn't been any financial loss, only a demand for payment? It may be that you have to wait for them to take you to court and then you defend your position in court. It may be that you have to pay "under protest" and then recover your money from them in the small claims court.


Keep a copy of the letter you send to them and the Post office slip for the delivery.

On the issue of your PC, buy a new HDD for about 50 - 60 quid it will be big enough.

Popo_4

Thank you very much for your reply, we really appreciate it.:beer:

You might have guessed it was AOL :rolleyes: .

We thought he was still in the first month as the CSR told him and reconfirmed that he would be charged on the 24th September. However, the credit card was charged around the 18th September (the 1st phone call took place on 18th August).

In any case, we still believe (due to what he was told) that he is in the first month until the 24th and as your advice makes perfect sense, we will return the modem tomorrow by special delivery. I'm drafting out a letter to explain, as you have said, that we dispute the charge and that the 12 month contract has started.

Thanks again, will update when I know more

Wig

Hang on, you are now getting on shaky ground. I would quote in your letter about being told you had until the 24th Sept, but what day did the modem arrive? I would say you had one month from that day. I still think you should return the modem tomorrow. Maybe in your letter, also , mention that your phone call was on the 18th, so how can they give you a free month from that day before supplying you with the modem?

Also tell them your dad has been in hospital which has complicated matters.

Tell them your computer is unable to accept a broadband connection because it is old and that the returned modem is unused, but your dad has been distracted because of hospital.

Popo_4

Shaky ground :eek: ??? Should I be even more worried?

I think the modem arrived about 2 days later. I will check with my dad tomorrow but it was definitely before he went in to hospital.

Wig wrote:

so how can they give you a free month from that day before supplying you with the modem?

It doesn't make sense - they're pants aren't they??!!

More (virtual) beer :beer: for your help and advice (am making notes of what's to go in the letter). Thank you.

Alfie_E

There’s also the issue that AOL will have taken the payment from your dad’s credit card using Continuous Payment Authority – CPA. See the thread Regular Payments off a Credit Card Discussion. This is summarised in Money Box’s Warning over credit trap. So, even when you think the matter is over and done with, AOL could potentially keep on taking the payment for months afterwards.

It might be worth trying to tackle the problem from the other end, straight away. You could dispute the credit card transaction as unauthorised with the credit card issuer. They’ll come back and say that it was done under CPA, and therefore can’t be disputed. You can then counter, explaining the confusion surrounding the situation, that your father didn’t give CPA in any informed manner and that AOL have declared that they don’t have a record of the telephone call to demonstrate that CPA was given.

micko2602

At no point have you mentioned that a contract was signed. If not then just send the modem back, cancel any agreement with your cc company and pursue you 1 month payment back via a small claim.
If you did sign a contract, then it would be stated there was a 30 day trail or cooling off period and it would state the date which this would start.

Wig

The lack of a signed contract is an issue but not so much so that it necessarily will be in popo's dads favour.

I want to know what paperwork (contracts) arrived with the modem. There should have been something which laid out the terms and conditions of the free trial period.

I said you were on shaky ground because you are now saying that the initial month has expired, according to them, according to you it is 24th, but this could have just been the date the payment was to be taken.

If there is a continuous payment Authority,

First phone up your card issuer and ask them if this can be initiated by a company based on a phonecall or a web page application form (if applicable). I know ntl initiated a CPA without my consent on dial up, I didn't mind at the time, then when we switched to pay as you go, some years later, they had gotten thier act together and there was a proper contract which laid out the CPA and gave me a tickbox.

Then write a letter to AOL cancelling the continous payment authority, photocopy and send a duplicate to your credit card customer services with an attached covering letter.
Whatever method was used to set up the CPA is acceptable as a method of cancellation, so if it was set up by phone conversation, then it can be cancelled by phone. Although they may insist (wrongly) that it has to be cancelled by letter.

Cancelling the CPA will just mean they start sending you demands for payment. If they have already taken the first payment this can be used as a convienient financial loss in the small claims court, the rest of the payments will stop or become due depending on what the court decides.

Popo_4

Just to let you know, my Dad has decided to keep the broadband connection and buy a new pc base unit. I was all hot and sweaty to get a complaint letter sent off and return the modem but it is entirely his decision. I think he didn't want the hassle of returning the modem/firing off a letter/possible small claims court etc and would like the convenience of broadband (even though it's with AOL :eek:). I was mistaken about the modem arriving 2 days after the phone call - it was in fact a week or more, but even worse: the free trial commenced the day broadband was offered ("ordered" according to them). Also no paperwork came with it. Could not find any email that mentioned a free trial or cooling off period. Not surprisingly most of what has been said on the phone by their CSRs doesn't tie in with what has been written in their emails :rolleyes: .

Anyway, thanks very much all of you for your help and advice. Virtual beer and lovely karma for you all :beer: .