help! now getting answers re our prospective purchase and this incudes subsidence!

apuleius

I've posted on here before re daughter's proposed purchase: flat in victorian conversion - one of four. To date we have had great problems getting answers concerning lease renewal (share of freehold) and management charges for services etc. This has led us to be suspicious. It is nine weeks since offer was accepted. One of the questions put to the vendor was concerning any outstanding insurance claims as when the EA showed me round they mentioned something about a tree causing some minor cracks to the ground floor exterior, however, nothing showed up at all in the surveyor's report. Our solicitor was in touch today re a subsidencde issue. Apparently the insurers have been involved for the last 18months with a subsidence claim caused partly by trees in the garden (some of which have been removed) and by neighbouring trees which are governed by a tree preservation order and the landowner of these trees is currently not in agreement with the insurance company concernin g their removal.

I have a number of questions:
Do we have any comeback with the surveyor? Obviously we would not have gone ahead if it had been known that there was a major subsideence issue.
Can we reclaim costs for the survey? And also for legal fees (we would not have proceeded to conveyancing if there was an issue with the survey). I should add that there is no evidence of movement in the flat my daughter is buying (it is on the top floor). However, the vendor was obviously aware of these issues, and has been copied in all the correspondence according to the company secretary, and should have advised us accordingly either through her solicitor or the EA.

Do we still proceed but ask for a major reduction? Is the vendor under a legal obligation to declare anything that would materially affect a prospective purchase.

Where does the EA stand in all of this?

Your answers would be appreciated, particularly from Richard Webster. At the moment we plan to go b ack to the solicitor tomorrow to seek their advice. I reckon this has so far cost us in the region of£1,500 which I would like to think has not been totally wasted. And it is a lovely flat.... but I guess in today's climate there will be plenty more out there.

Doozergirl

What kind of survey was it that you had carried out?

Is the subsidence issue still ongoing or has it been rectified? It sounds like it isn't. Ask to see copies of the paperwork relating to the insurance claim - there should be structural engineers reports etc.

The EA stands nowhere, it sounds like they even tried to tell you.

Personally, if this is an ongoing issue which is in dispute I think you should *probably* walk away. I am not frightened of subsidence at all and on a freehold house, providing I know what the issue is and how to deal with it, then I'm not really bothered. The thing with flats is that it takes a lot of people to organise things and it can make things harder.

There is however the opportunity for a hefty discount IMVHO. You need to read through the paperwork and make an informed decision.

apuleius

homebuyers survey and obviously the mortgage valuation survey. Yes they said something to me but not to my daughter who is the buyer and she has been back a couple of times - we have been querying this issue for a while. Work to recticfy the problem is due to be carried out soon.

apuleius

Thanks Doozergirl for your most helpful reply. It is a good suggestion to ask for the inusrance paperwork, and yes the idea of a large discount also appeals. However I'm not sure that a FTB needs to take on all these problems in this market, so she is probably going to walk away from this one. We are going back to the surveyor to find out why they gave this property a clean bill and to get them to come back at no charge for a further survey. To get the full picture. How do you think we stand with making a claim against the surveyor (it was e-surv)?

Anyway we are in a good position with deposit and mortgage offer to start all over again.

Anyone else have views on this?

apuleius

Sorry forgot to include that the claim is still ongoing with disputed trees down as the cause, but works to rectify due to commence in the near future.

Richard_Webster

I was away yesterday so have only just seen this thread. Doozergirl has provided some sensible answers to some of the points.

The seller is probably hoping the whole problem will just go away and is not really doing anything to push things forward to a resolution.

When a surveyor does a survey on a flat, he can only look at the flat in question in detail and look at the exterior of the building insofar as it is accessible. Depending on the circumstances the subsidence might not have been evident without internal inspection.

I would be inclined to walk away, because as Doozer suggests there are other people involved and getting them all to co-operate could take time.

apuleius

Richard thank you and Doozergirl for your helpful replies. Yes, it looks like we will walk away from this scenario. It also explains why all our questions were met with blanks - and not for want of the solicitor pushing. It also explains why a second flat (of the four) is also for sale (just gone under offer - do they know what a minefield they've walked into). I just wish that there was more transparency. It still does not explain how the surveyor messed up. His report clearly states no evidence of external subsidence and the cracks are there to be seen! Do we have redress from the surveyor i.e. any chance of reclaiming the fee - surely this is negligence, or will they be covered by the usual clause ...'at the time of inspection....'.
It is annoying as if this had been discovered at the outset we would not have incurred fees - mortgage set up fee, survey, solicitors disbursements, but still with a falling market we should recoup these on the next purchase and we do have a mortgage offer in place for four months more!

Doozergirl

You can certainly try! I'd re-read the section on movement of the property to see if it is that cut and dried. Surveyors have a very good habit of covering their proverbials. They litter their reports with disclaimers.

Ae you sure it clearly says "There is no evidence of external subsidence" because they'd be more likely to use the phrase 'structural movement' or similar. All houses move. If I were a surveyor, I'd be unlikely to use such a phrase for that reason.

Even if they are wooly about movement in their report, you may be able to get some kind of goodwill gesture from them, though I suspect it would only be part of hte fee that you paid.

apuleius

exact wording:
no evidence of significant structural movement was noted to the main building
We have requested structural engingeers report from the other side. I think if cracks have been monitored for 18 months I would call that significant.

Doozergirl

Go get them!

It does say 'significant' but ho hum, there's some cracks that have probably got tiny little monitors stuck on them if it's still being monitored. Could the surveyor access the back where the problems are?

apuleius

I'm not sure if the surveyor got round the back - we never did, and we would certainly have asked for garden access before exchange anyway. This demonstrates that one really has to cover all fronts and leave no stone unturned. This makes me very distrustful of surveys: what is the point of paying extra for the homebuyers when they miss one of the most important reasons for having a survey in the first place!