Icelandic Banks

ianmr65

Intresting a first post slagging off an icelandic bank. Are you getting worried now the Krona is recovering and all the investigations have been launched?

Many banks here, and abroad have a clause saying they have a right to suspend withdrawls, in exceptional circumstances, without specifying how long, or what consitutes an exceptional circumstance.

By Your logic, this implies they are wriggling out of ever paying you back.

By definition if a bank is a subsidiary it will have duties to it's parent. I'm sure abbey has similar clauses with Santander ect.

Grow Up!

What people should really be asking themselves is what intrest does IMCAT have in suddenly appearing with this post. What intrest do people who slag off the icelandic banks have. And why should they be motivated, to post this way.
Especially bearing in mind the UK, US, AUSTRALIAN, and ICELANDIC authorities are running investigations into rumour mongering speculators who stand to gain if a bank's share prices fall.

home_alone

ianmr65 wrote: »

What people should really be asking themselves is what intrest does IMCAT have in suddenly appearing with this post. What intrest do people who slag off the icelandic banks have. And why should they be motivated, to post this way.
Especially bearing in mind the UK, US, AUSTRALIAN, and ICELANDIC authorities are running investigations into rumour mongering speculators who stand to gain if a bank's share prices fall.

My feelings exactly, there does seem to be a few of these bankbust trolls around maybe its the same group, its getting a bit tedious now. Its enlightening looking back at some posters posts after a few months its usually the same theme.

gary

Meltdown_2

imcat wrote: »

Lesson here is to read your small print.

No, the real lesson here is don't believe everything you read. Check for yourself everything purported to be 'facts'.

If you open an account with Kaupthing Edge your deposit will initially be taken by Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander Limited. KSF is fully covered under the FSCS compensation scheme and is authorised by the FSA to take deposits.

I'm not sure why you insert the word 'initially', but essentially correct.
Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander has FSA registration no. 140839.

However, your contract states that you consent to your account and contract being novated across to Kaupthing Bank. This dramatically changes the protection you are afforded.

In essence, 'novated' means 'moved'.
The contract states that if Kaupthing did intend to do this, then they would give you notice. However, having such a provision in a contract (one that isn't actually in force) does not 'dramatically change the protection you are afforded'.
(Though it might be useful to check what all your contracts with banks state. You might be surprised at the wide-ranging provisions in some of them. )

Kaupthing Bank is not fully covered by the FSCS. It is registered with the FSA but not permissioned to take deposits.

Wrong. Kaupthing Bank hf (FSA Registration 222968) is a Bank incorporated in the EEA, entitled to accept deposits in the UK. It was approved in February 2008 for 'topping up'. This simply places Kaupthing Bank hf (the parent company) in the same position as Landsbanki hf (the company behind Icesave) meaning that deposits in the UK (with the parent company) would get the full level of compensation as deposits with other banks in the UK. This is sensible business practice. The banks to worry about are those that haven't been approved for 'topping up' - in particular those that haven't applied to be placed in that position.

As an aside, Banco Santander (Abbey's parent) are in the same position as Kaupthing Bank hf (i.e. incorporated in the EEA, entitled to accept deposits in the UK).
So are Bank of Ireland (who operate the Post Office accounts), Danske Bank (owners of Northern Bank), ING, ...

For background, here are a couple of links to relevant parts of the EU website.
press release dated 28 November 2006
Communication of the EU Commission
One should perhaps note
(a) that one of the major stumbling blocks to having the money 'already there' in case compensation is needed is the cost that would impose on the UK banking sector, and
(b) that the best compensation package is in Italy - Intesa Sanpaolo, anyone?

All claims would have to be pursued through the Icelandic authorities first and FSCS will only cover any outstanding amounts after that process is complete. I have spoken with the FSA and FCSC and they confirm this is correct.

The above is a totally hypothetical situation, and does not apply to your deposits in Kaupthing Edge as things stand. There is no indication that Kaupthing have any intention to change things. You make statements about what the FSA and FSCS policies are/will be without any evidence to back this up.
Please copy your emails to this forum or give us verbatim transcripts of what they told you over the phone.

By this mechanism Kaupthing Edge & Kaupthing Bank are attempting to bypass the protections of of the FSA and FSCS.

Nonsense. Kaupthing are not "attempting" anything.

It is not illegal ( they are a bit misleading in their advertising though)

Would you like to explain how?

but you need to ask yourself why they are doing this rather than getting themselves properly authorised before putting your hard earn cash with them.

Doing what?
They are 'properly authorised'.
They currently have full FSCS protection for your deposits up to the £35,000 limit.
What more do you want ...

ianmr65

Meltdown wrote: »

As an aside, Banco Santander (Abbey's parent) are in the same position as Kaupthing Bank hf (i.e. incorporated in the EEA, entitled to accept deposits in the UK).
So are Bank of Ireland (who operate the Post Office accounts), Danske Bank (owners of Northern Bank), ING, ...

...

I knew santander would be in the same position. Well done Mel !! excellent post.

see http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.html?t=847519

for the latest on how the rumour mongers such as imcat, are gonna be for the high jump!!

OliverDog_2

I am a novice on financial matters and took advice from some of the people who has posted on here. I previously put a post about my savings in Kaupthing Bank actually in Iceland. I received very good information from some of you here, thanks as I was very worried. I have myself since spoken to Kaupthing Edge (as I was incorrectly put through to them) your money is covered up to £35,000 seperately by different funds here.

I have also spokent to Kaupthing Bank in Iceland and the same as the UK £35,000 of my money is covered here albeit by a governement scheme, which I would have to go through Iceland for.

I completely agree with your comments about the recent negative posts, what interest to they have except for people like myself to become frightened move their money at a considerable loss from which they benefit from.. unscrupolous....:mad:

StevieJ

A little confused by the last post, I presume that the money is in an account in Iceland (not UK). Why is the account covered up to 35k and not the 15k that has been mentioned on these boards when referring to the Iceland deposit scheme?

ianmr65

StevieJ wrote: »

A little confused by the last post, I presume that the money is in an account in Iceland (not UK). Why is the account covered up to 35k and not the 15k that has been mentioned on these boards when referring to the Iceland deposit scheme?

Oliver D has her money in Icelandic Krona, in iceland with Kuapthing bank. Not Kaupthing Edge.
I think the last thing we need is a debate on here, as to how Icelandnic funds, in krona are protected, in Iceland. The big issue for Oliver d is the icelandic Krona/ pound exchange rate.

OliverDog_2

Yes you are right I was talking about Krona in Iceland

This may help if anyone wants to have a look but it is NOT relevant
to Kaupthing Edge or Icesave accounts

Quote from Kaupthing Bank in Iceland:

This quarantee does apply to Money market savings account.
We have working insurance benefits fund for investers. http://www.tryggingarsjodur.is/ Purpose of this found is too provide owner of credit and investers protection. Ministry of finance does have supervision over this found.

Here you can find Laws and regulations http://eng.idnadarraduneyti.is/laws-and-regulations/nr/1165

imcat

StevieJ wrote: »

A little confused by the last post, I presume that the money is in an account in Iceland (not UK). Why is the account covered up to 35k and not the 15k that has been mentioned on these boards when referring to the Iceland deposit scheme?

If the money is held in Iceland, their own compensation scheme will cover up to approx £16k. Because Kaupthing has EEA registration with the FSA the FCSC will cover any short fall up to £35k. However, you will need to deal with the icelandic authorities first which could be easy or could be hard. No one knows until one goes bust.

Now, to answer all of the other posters on this board calling me a troll all I can say is grow up and learn some basic economics or learn the hard way.

Kaupthing is rated as one of the riskiest banks around. It is not me saying this, it is the other banks and insurance companies. If you think you know better than them, the experts, then good for you.

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/investing-and-markets/article.html?in_article_id=433257&in_page_id=3

The reason they are able to offer such good rates is that it is currently cheaper to source their funds from foreign investors rather through sources such as Libor which is running at around 7%. Whilst strong at home it is very vunerable to a run on it by foreign investors because of this.

I was about to invest a very large sum of money (£100k's) with them until my own UK bank advised against it and said limit it to £35K which is what I have done. Kaupthing has made great play on being fully covered by FCSC because without it no one in their sane mind would give them any money considering how risky the other banks view them.

Making the consent to novate the contract overseas key in it's T&Cs is unique. I challenge anyone to find a similar clause in any other banks T&Cs. The clause is in there because the arrangement with KSF is only temporary. Look at the wording on Kaupthing Edges website under about us. "Your savings are currently held by our UK subsidiary, Kaupthing Singer & Friedlander".

Currently?? Why else is the consent to novate explicit in T&C their unless they are planning to use it at some point in the future. And ask youself why they feel the need to have it all. It is not KSF that needs your money but the Bank back in Iceland. For those that think it is one and the same please go and understand the legal and fiscal differences between a branch and a limited entity.

If it does novate, your money would still be safe as it would first be covered by Iceland's compensation scheme and then any shortfall made up by the FSCS. However, this is a much more laborious process and not one I would want to go through. This is why i didn't invest in Icesave and other similar accounts.

The FSCS have confirmed this. You are having a laugh if you think i am going to record my conversation with them for your benefit? Why not call them yourself and ask if you do not believe me. The number is on the website.

The minute I get notice of the novation, my money is coming out straight away. I am sure I won't be the only one. If the run is large enough they will be at risk so it would be interesting to see if they will ever do this.

Still want to invest more than £35k?

chesky369

.....I was about to invest a very large sum of money (£100k's) with them until my own UK bank advised against it .....

Well, there's a surprise