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Fluoride in tap water
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The oxymoronic heading: "The Science of Alternative Medicine" should have been a clue for you Bernard.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alternative_medicine
Oh the irony. Wikipedia as the fount of all worthwhile "knowledge"? :rotfl:
Hi Toothsmith - good to see you keeping the thread alive
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If you'd been just a tiny bit more open-minded there TS you'd see that the article wasToothsmith wrote: »And the advert for the current issue bears the headline 'MEAT' with a picture of blood dripping from someone's highly glossed lips.
So that's a balanced rational magazine then!
”Meat: Eco villain or victim of spin? Livestock production takes a heavy toll on the planet, but as Simon Fairlie and Richard Young find, giving up meat may not be the most sustainable way to live”
I took that red stuff to be some good old tomato ketchup dripping off an organic something or other.
Have to say that some of the covers of the BDA publications are a bit dodgy. At least the Ecologist seems to be pretty open about its funding.
The last copy I saw of Launchpad ( that freebie thing that the BDA bounces out to all newbies in the first year of dental school) is “supported by” a mouthwash product that contains……..drum rolls here folks…… yes, our old mate fluoride. The product is not just mentioned on the cover but all over the place inside. No wonder so many dentists find it hard to think for themselves - product placement all the way through, plus some goody bags at the BDA conference.
Still, I guess all the articles in there will be balanced ones.;)0 -
What are your views on the articles on post 223, Ben 84.
They contain a lot of dramatic claims which are not referenced or backed up in any form. There are some references, but not for any of the big claims being made.
It really is just the opinion of some random man I've never heard of before, and in this case like some other people have commented, I then look at the format he's being published in and find it hard to take his claims seriously.
The products are pretty suspect. Take for example the EMF detector:Some research suggests that high level electromagnetic fields (EMFs) caused by simple electrical wiring problems may interfere with the production of melatonin, the hormone that helps us get to sleep. You can quickly and easily test your bedroom and other rooms in your house for unsafe EMFs with the Dr. Gauss Meter.
I don't think there is much I can add to this, it's just bad science. I consider all this alternative medicine with the same suspicion. It creates unhealthy obsessions and makes a lot of money from them. People become convinced they have to start consuming vast amounts of exotic magic beans that cure every known disease (plus a few made up ones), detoxing their house and wearing magnets to protect themselves from electromagnetic radiation, not to mention buying huge amounts of alternative therapy books and audio tapes.0 -
I don't quite understand the point you're trying to make?
If any of the stuff foisted on newly qualifed dentists contained half the barfaced lies of the Anti-F brigade, they would be laughed out the room.
Part of the training is to be able to evaluate proper evidence just so that we can spot poor claims from manufacturers.
I don't understand where you get the idea from that there is a big manufacturer of 'fluoride' who is trying to pollute the world.
If it really was that easy to conspire to get bad stuff put in the water, then surely it would be more sensible for dentists to hoodwink the world into getting sugar put into the water? That would actually make us some money!How to find a dentist.
1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.0 -
Oh the irony. Wikipedia as the fount of all worthwhile "knowledge"? :rotfl:
You should read what they say about fluoride.
I'd trust that more than the stuff quoted on here!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FluorideHow to find a dentist.
1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.0 -
:laugh:I think you perhaps do - you seem to describe any publication that airs viewpoints opposite to your own as being biased and unreliable whilst failing to acknowledge that extremely well funded bias exists in abundance on the pro-f side?Toothsmith wrote: »I don't quite understand the point you're trying to make?
The dentistry sector is so good at evaluating things (and so free from commercial pressures) that we'll not mention again that "slap" the profession got for endorsing a blackcurrant drink as " toothkind", nor the fact that divisions of the same company who push out fizzy sugary drinks on one hand and fluoride mouthwashes with the other (double the profits-kerching !) also help fund dentistry "conferences".Toothsmith wrote: »I If any of the stuff foisted on newly qualifed dentists contained half the barfaced lies of the Anti-F brigade, they would be laughed out the room.
Part of the training is to be able to evaluate proper evidence just so that we can spot poor claims from manufacturers.
I said before that if everyone was totally honest about where their funding came from, whether for a "review" or for the provision of the "independent" NFIS et al , we'd all be able to see far more clearly what's based on industry "propaganda", with a heavy dose of commercial vested interest, or govt lies, because the NHS system is failing and water fluoridation is a cheap fix if they can persuade enough people " it's for the children".
It's interesting that you brought up the link with sugar - sorry to link back but as I said beforeToothsmith wrote: »I don't understand where you get the idea from that there is a big manufacturer of 'fluoride' who is trying to pollute the world.
If it really was that easy to conspire to get bad stuff put in the water, then surely it would be more sensible for dentists to hoodwink the world into getting sugar put into the water? That would actually make us some money!
Sugar producers and their services to dentistry, eh?Fluoride promotion is backed by commercial concerns, and there is insufficient openness about this..............
One of the most important factors in dental caries is the frequent consumption of sugar products, but no-one wants to recommend self-control, nor to upset the mighty sugar corporations, who also have a vested interest in promoting the use of fluoride (they altruistically provide an educational grant for the production of a freely distributed “Dental Digest” and their education resources for parents & teachers are pro-fluoride)
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They contain a lot of dramatic claims which are not referenced or backed up in any form. There are some references, but not for any of the big claims being made.
It really is just the opinion of some random man I've never heard of before, and in this case like some other people have commented, I then look at the format he's being published in and find it hard to take his claims seriously.
The products are pretty suspect. Take for example the EMF detector:
I don't think there is much I can add to this, it's just bad science. I consider all this alternative medicine with the same suspicion. It creates unhealthy obsessions and makes a lot of money from them. People become convinced they have to start consuming vast amounts of exotic magic beans that cure every known disease (plus a few made up ones), detoxing their house and wearing magnets to protect themselves from electromagnetic radiation, not to mention buying huge amounts of alternative therapy books and audio tapes.
Why suspicion to alternative medicine and none to conventional medicine.
Have you not read about Iatrogenic deaths.
http://www.whale.to/drugs/iat.html
http://www.whale.to/d/toxic.html0 -
Ribena Toothkind wasn't fizzy, or sugary.
It was endorsed by the BDA, but that just got funds for the BDA, not 'dentistry'.
There was as much critisism of the BDA by dentists for this as there was from anywhere else.
The objection was to the term 'toothKIND'. It was certainly a whole lot less damaging than any other drink available, with the exceptions of water or milk.
I was at a BDA lecture in Birmingham several years ago when a Smithklein Beecham man was given a very hard time about the claims on Ribena toothkind - and if they intended to phase out all the rubbish Ribena to replace it entirely with the toothkind brand. They didn't.How to find a dentist.
1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.0 -
Why suspicion to alternative medicine and none to conventional medicine.
Have you not read about Iatrogenic deaths.
http://www.whale.to/drugs/iat.html
http://www.whale.to/d/toxic.html
This isn't really relevant to fluoride in the water at a dose of 1ppm though is it?
When loosing the argument - go off on a tangent? More nazi propaganda techniques?How to find a dentist.
1. Get recommendations from friends/family/neighbours/etc.
2. Once you have a short-list, VISIT the practices - dont just phone. Go on the pretext of getting a Practice Leaflet.
3. Assess the helpfulness of the staff and the level of the facilities.
4. Only book initial appointment when you find a place you are happy with.0
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