NPower gas 'sculpting'

Cardew

Anne3333 wrote: »

The lower tier charges being reduced would not compensate low users though, would it?

No. That presumably is why the £6(average) will be awarded to some people.

Don't forget with 'sculpting' most people would have used more than the tier 1 allowance during the summer of 2007(when it was a flat rate) so the tier 2 units used would have offset some of the extra units.

Anne3333

Sitting here excitedly thinking how I am going to spend my £6. Now shall I have a medium sized Margherita Pizza from Pizzahut or 2 portions of Vegetable Somosa from the local curry house? The excitement of it all!

1carminestocky

There are people on here who have previously challenged certain posters for having the temerity to suggest OFGEM are useless. I wonder if it's time for these posters to admit what the more enlightened on here have always thought - they ARE useless and they ARE NOT the consumers friend. In fact, they are the exact opposite of that...

DirectDebacle

Although initially disappointing the Ofgem ruling is not a total loss.

As I understand it they have ruled that npower were wrong in their assumption that making changes to the way they charged for gas were not notifiable changes. Quite rightly we should have been informed.

What is puzzling is that they (Ofgem) have concentrated only on the specifc issue of the price change to the lower tier units and whether or not any customers lost out because of this. They seem to have accepted npowers argument that very few did (presumably the 200,000) and only by a small amount. Ofgem seem to have given themselves a very narrow remit and failed to see the bigger picture. As such the main area for customers claims has not been resolved but nevertheless an important ruling which will assist those claims has been made by Ofgem.

In my case the bulk of my claim was that npower had failed to notify changes since 1st April,2003. I claimed my gas charges be recalculated with the prices in effect at 31st March,2003. This was vigorously contested by npower as it made up the bulk of the money I was claiming from them. Had this ruling by Ofgem been made at the time I was making my claim it would have been of help to me. It would not have dissuaded me from making the claim. As far as that goes the validity of such claims has not been affected by the ruling.

Also Ofgem have not given npower a green light to regard a year as anything other than a continuous period of 12 months. npower may construe from the ruling that it has. However claims for being charged for more than 4572kWh in a year should still be pursued as Ofgem did not address this issue.

Cardew

DirectDebacle wrote: »

Also Ofgem have not given npower a green light to regard a year as anything other than a continuous period of 12 months. npower may construe from the ruling that it has. However claims for being charged for more than 4572kWh in a year should still be pursued as Ofgem did not address this issue.

DD,
Have you seen the full ofgem adjudication?

Perhaps I am missing something, but as I said in the post above, surely the vast majority of NPower customers were charged for 2000 more Tier 1 units in a 12 month period - which is a lot more than £6.

From the 'note to editors' in the ruling it also appears "Npower has now revised the wording of its contract information in order to clarify the period over which the higher tariffs are calculated"

Which appears to me that they have licence to 'restart the clock'.

DirectDebacle

Cardew wrote: »

From the 'note to editors' in the ruling it also appears "Npower has now revised the wording of its contract information in order to clarify the period over which the higher tariffs are calculated"

Which appears to me that they have licence to 'restart the clock'.

Hi Cardew. I am not disagreeing with you. Essentially the status quo has been preserved as per the 'sculpting issue'. I did check npower T&C's and their charging conditions here http://www.npower.com/web/At_home/electricity_and_gas/terms_and_conditions/index.htm and here
http://npower.com/web/At_home/customer_service/yourquestionsanswered/faq_understanding_my_prices

I could find no changes and nothing as regards a 'tariff year' restarting when changes to prices/methods of charging were made.It may be buried deep in their website but I haven't delved too deeply.

Reading the Ofgem press release it seems they were merely concerned with the notification or lack of it that npower gave to customers.

The regulator was concerned about Npower’s approach to notifying its customers of the changes which resulted in financial loss to some households whose consumption was low.

Ofgem seem to have been only concerned with the notification issue.
They have not challenged starting a new 'tariff year' when prices change.

Note to editors

• [FONT=&quot]The investigation was in relation to so-called two-tier tariffs which have two payment levels. The amount of gas consumed during the tariff year that is subject to the higher charge varies according to season. Every time Npower altered its charges it started a new tariff year on which charges are based. So some consumers whose consumption had taken them into the lower level charges were placed back on the higher level when new charges were introduced, although the vast majority of customers benefitted from the reduction in prices also made at that time. Npower has now revised the wording of its contract information in order to clarify the period over which the higher tariffs are calculated. [/FONT]

The above is a note to media editors by way of a simple explanation of the background and is not an endorsement of npowers methods just the circumstances that existed at the time of the investigation.

I agree with you that they can continue the 'sculpting' scam but I do not agree that Ofgem have endorsed the restart of the tariff year. They accepted this as a condition that existed at the time of the matter they were investigating but it was not part of their remit to challenge the restarting a 'tariff year'. They were only looking at the way customers were notified of changes, rather than the changes themselves. A moot point but important as the whole 'sculpting issue' as we know it has not been investigated.

I was hoping the Ofgem enquiry would have put this matter to bed. It is still very much wide awake and likely to be continued.

I still maintain this has no effect on 'sculpting' overcharging that occurred. This investigation has merely looked at how and when customers should be notified of changes and sought to compensate the very few low users that lost out as a result of the changes.

I expect npower feel they have got away with it. Up to the customers to let them know they haven't.

shoopshoop

Hello again folks, Just to let you know that with the help of DD I have worked out my overcharge regarding tier 1 units (£50) I have also added some extra for compensation. We will see what happens. Letter to be sent recorded delivery today.

shoopshoop

DirectDebacle

shoopshoop wrote: »

We will see what happens. Letter to be sent recorded delivery today.

shoopshoop

Thanks for letting us know. Let us know how you get on. May take some time.

Cardew

DirectDebacle wrote: »

Thanks for letting us know. Let us know how you get on. May take some time.

As you still owe me a virtual pint:beer: from earlier in this thread, I will offer you a chance to go 'double or quits' DD.

My bet is, at least initially, they will quote the ofgem 'ruling' and refute the claim.

I appreciate it wasn't a 'ruling' etc.

Are you on?

P.S.
A bet I will be happy to lose!

shoopshoop

They can quote the Ofgem ruling at me if they like, they won't change my mind!