Debt Problem ... longish post

Apple_2

This post is all about my O/H. We've been together 4 years. I've always known he had debts ( he said 20kish ) but he's wanted to handle them and I didn't interfere.
Basically 6 months ago he broke down crying. I found out how bad things were. What had forced him to face reality was letters from the I.R. threatening distraint proceedings. He was scared s***less.
Background - he'd worked on and off for past 3 years, hadn't filed tax returns, hadn't paid tax, but 'spent' this money on making payments on the 40k debts and paying some off. He'd only transferred the debt from c/c's to the I.R. ( idiot man !! )
I'm handling all his stuff now and even though he's worried, we have a gameplan. I've made decisions for him ( he's happy with ) but maybe others can tell me if I'm missing anything.
Situation now : I.R. will be ok hopefully. Returns are filed, debt is 17k, instalment plan agreed, he is working ( was not for 12 months ). contract finishes dec 2005. Every penny goes to the I.R. He should have paid it off Dec but will be tight.
Other Debts - 2 credit cards ( 3k & 3.7k ) 2 loans ( 4k & 5.2k ). We've written ( before he was working ) explaining he couldn't maintain payments as not working. I will lend O/H 4k if these ppl agree !!!!!!'s. Offer put - 3 refused 4th waiting, expect refusal. Sent full details of total debts to them including I.R. They have all info. However they don't know he's working - if they did they'd want payments - all his cash HAS to go to I.R. as priority debt.
One c/c has gone to internal debt collector. One c/c they won't default till another 4 monthly payments missed. One loan seems to be internally going through their system, one loan waiting on their response to offer.
In Dec when he's out of work again, I.R. will be paid off but this 16k still outstanding. If CCJ he is not working so zero income. He has no assets to take ( lives with me in my house ).
Is there anything I should be doing different ????? Any help appreciated.

James240

ooo that is a bit complicated Apple im at a bit of a loss on how to advise, all i can say is hang in there and the more expert MSE users will post on here soon to help u

All the best

James

Xbigman

If you are making full and final offers then wait for the accounts to be sent to debt collectors. The main lenders usually have a policy of turning them down flat. Debt collectors are more realistic about things and will do a deal.

What area does he work in? It might be more sensible to get out of contract work and take a permanent position, even if lower paid.

I hope he appreciates you.
Regards



X

Apple_2

Xbigman

On the full & final offers that's what I thought too ( I'm learning about this stuff real fast ). We settled one small debt of £ 250 for £ 50 via debt collectors. Like I said we've got this gameplan which I think is the only option he has. But the c/c & loan companies are so frustrating. I send everything recorded but amazingly stuff goes missing or is just ignored. It seems to be a long drawn out process and almost a war of attrition. But that's just the way it is.
No he can't switch from contract to permanent. He tried while he wasn't working but couldn't get anything. He's 51 and age is against him.
I just wondered if anyone could see anything I couldn't. What I posted seemed the 'right' course of action, but other people will have more debt experience than me and could maybe suggest something else ??? Like I said 6 months ago I didn't have a clue how any of this worked.

Thanks

Apple_2

Any other idea's out there ?

Thanks

idiot_3

offering £4k on £15k is very unlikely to be accepted.

it may be best to let them go to debt collectors, then pay reduced payments, with the cards now being at 0%.

if you send a copy of your (his) budget with a written offer, then 9/10 any offer will be accepted. as far as they are concerned, any money back is better than none.

make sure you do everything in writing, that way you have proof you have tried to fix the situation, if (god forbid) it ends up in court. this way the magistrate should look more kindly on you.

of course currently the I.R. is priority. he will not end up inside due to unsecured credit card debt, but could if he mucks the I.R. about.

Dammam

I don't know how the law stands, but I'd guess that the IR has priority over every other creditor. Just an idea, and I may be totally wrong, but if you explain again that there is no money in the pot because of the IR arrears and that you are willing to use your savings (£4000) in full and final settlement to try and ease the stress on OH it may direct the emphasis away from him and onto you, the good samaritan trying to help out with your own money - 25% of something is a hell of a lot better than 100% of nothing at the end of the day.

Apple_2

Thanks for the replies.

Yes it seems I have to let the debts go to debt collectors. The lenders won't accept the offer ( I understand - it's low ) but there's nothing else in the pot for them so we'll deal with the collectors later on.

Don't understand the mind-set though. One of the c/c's having been informed of his problems, been given copies of all o/s creditors including I.R., been made offer, rejected offer, been asked to review offer again - have refused to default the c/c until another 4 payments have been missed !! Just keeps racking up interest, penalty charges etc. I understand they earn off this, but it seems unethical to me ( but what do I know !! )

Other thing is even though I'm writing to them ( he's done letter of authority ) they only ever write to him and telephone him. They do speak to me when I telephone because they are authorised to do so on computer, but still all contact is aimed to him.

Ho Humm

Murtle

Point of lest resistance - as in your OH, it's easier to crack someone who's already down, then crack someone who has more chance of saying *get lost*

Keep at it, he's lucky to have such a great person as you.

Dammam

It's ridiculous that the original creditors wont accept the !!!!!! isn't it? They would prefer to sell the debt on at (probably) less than you're willing to pay. Seems pure bloody mindedness to me.

westernpromise

Apple wrote:

Yes it seems I have to let the debts go to debt collectors. The lenders won't accept the offer ( I understand - it's low ) but there's nothing else in the pot for them so we'll deal with the collectors later on.

What will probably happen is that the debt collectors will phone him and try to extract as much info as possible re his employment, income, etc., to establish whether there's any prospect of recovering anything anytime soon. They will also probably make vaguely threatening noises about being summonsed for non-payment.

Say nothing over the phone, emphasise that you're taking the matter seriously, and ask for a written breakdown of the alleged debt. Keep the correspondence (including the envelopes; DCs are not supposed to tell you you have x days to pay or else, while posting the letter saying this the day before. This is regarded as unfair pressure).

Reply in writing, set out what you've said here, and offer them your £4k in !!!!!! after he's paid off the Revenue. Include the evidence that he's boracic till December and perhaps beyond. I'd mention that it's your £4k and is your life savings and that there is no more where it comes from.

The debt collector should then realise that, if you are telling the truth, there's no point taking your O/H to a county court. He plainly can't pay, and a court will not order him to pay when he obviously cannot afford to. County courts aren't there to just rubber-stamp debt chasers' demands for money.

In fact, if you have put all this to the DC and the DC has just ignored it all and proceeded with a summons anyway, the court may very well get p1ssed off at having its time wasted, and instead hand the DC its ar5e on a plate (eg by striking some or all of the debt out - yes, county courts can do that). It has been known. This is why it's important to get a breakdown of how the debt built up. If a lot of it is punitive late payment charges etc, you could argue to a court that that portion of what's being sought is unfair and excessive.

The DC knows all this about courts, and expects you not to. Just get it all in writing and make sure you provide all the evidence of what he's earning and whre it's going - in your case the latter is a pretty short list. The DCs should then look at the facts, realise the cost of hassling you legally is going to exceed the likely rewards, and start talking about a deal.

Be patient, be strong, remember that you are neither alone nor the first person this has ever happened to, and start thinking about the rest of your life.