Smart meters are not so smart after all FYI

Bendo

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82113819#Comment_82113819

They already do, my Ohme when I was on Agile wouldn't start charging at the second the rates changed, there was a few mins delay for that reason, it's a requirement in the regs.

Covered by the relevant legislation here https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2021/1467/made

Ildhund

@Scot_39 wrote:

Ildhund who quoted me the deriviation of the final time used many moons ago suspects in reality no one would get over 15m.

Yeah, it's a bit esoteric. The 'Randomized Offset Number' is 'between 0 and 1' and baked into the meter in the factory, I take that to mean that it can be neither 0 nor 1. The other element, the 'Randomized Offset Limit', is 'a value in seconds in the range 0 to 1799', so both of those are in scope. This number is entered by the installing engineer, so that's how he could in effect disable the offset by entering 0. My guess at the reason we rarely (never?) see offsets over 16 minutes is that engineers only enter a 3-figure number, possibly by design. 999 seconds is 16.65 minutes, which would be the absolute maximum when RON = 1 and ROL = 999. I wonder whether engineers routinely enter their 3-digit crimping tool number. Here's the SMETS2 reference:

There is a SMETS service request that suppliers can issue to find out precisely what the offset is for any SMETS2 meter.

Scot_39

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82113819#Comment_82113819

there was still well over 2m on e7 when the fuss about equal discounts kicked off during epg era - and 1m who came off rts in last few years - few on vanipla e7 i suspect - suspect many but not all will have some variant of storage hesters.

Wheras theres already around 2.1m bev cars and 1.1m plug in hybrids - up 0.5m this year to July according to smmt and zapmap.

The thing that surprised me most only c121,000 light vans.

I suspect if were not their yet, it wont be long until EVs beat conventional electrical heating as theres only around 4.5m homes off the gas grid, and many larger off grid homes could be on oil or lpg style alternatives.

the growth in evs pure bevs and plug in hybrid (still about 1/3rd of total) massively out running ashp despite £7.5k grants - which fell to sub 11k instals in q1 this year, after a high of 52k for 2025. And the govt target for end 2028 around just 600k, well below ev adoption rates, and from memory nowhere near on target at that rate with around just 250k installed total at end 2025.

WiserMiser

The reason for E7 traditionally staying on GMT all year is that the original timers back in the 1970s were electrically wound-up clockwork. It also had the benefit that standalone timers for immersion heaters didn't have to be reset twice per year.

Addendum

Some background info for our younger readers.👶 Although Quartz clocks had become available for consumer goods, they would have needed very long battery backup times (2-3 week outages not impossible in some remote areas because of storms, snowdrifts, flooding etc). For backup, there wasn't much more than flooded lead acid batteries, so they would have needed frequent replacement and wouldn't have liked cold or freezing outdoor locations. Although relatively primitive, the clockwork spring went the distance; nothing else was so cheap and maintenance free.

squirrelpie

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82113790#Comment_82113790

My car is a Kia! You didn't read my post "Why car manufacturers can't realise that what they display on the
dashboard may or may not be what I want on their charge control timer"

born_again

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82114035#Comment_82114035

Given that many of the posts are saying E7 stays on GMT (& you did nit say you were not on E7), then given Kia do not auto change, if you set clock when on GMT, then it will stay on GMT & charging time will also be on GMT as displayed on the dash 👍

Swipe

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82114022#Comment_82114022

Interesting. I'm very grateful for that. I'd hate to lose that later morning off peak hour during BST.

Ildhund

@WiserMiser wrote:

… E7 traditionally staying on GMT all year … had the benefit that standalone timers for immersion heaters didn't have to be reset twice per year.

I wonder how that's supposed to work? My SMETS2 meter is set for E7 with bog standard offpeak 00:00-07:00 GMT. That means that during BST, the offpeak period starts at 01:00 according to the clock on my kitchen wall. It also means that I have to adjust the immersion heater timer - vintage 1989 - twice a year using the markers at the top of the dial.

The big advantage of this timing regime is that during BST I can enjoy an electric shower at less eye-watering rates so long as I'm finished before 08:06, when my meter switches to the peak rate register. In winter I either shower at midnight or stay dirty.

WiserMiser

Think you're doing it wrong.🤔 The idea is that if you have all-year-round-E7-on-GMT, once you've set your timer you then leave it well alone (unless it's mechanical and needs resetting after any outage).

Depending on the season, you just look at the relevant black marker line and ignore the other one. So if your photo was taken at just after 2pm today then everything is fine.

silverwhistle

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82113839#Comment_82113839

No. There is far more diversity with EV charging. Some people may only charge once a week or even every two weeks. On some of Octopus's tariffs you specify what you want and when by and they will change the charge times and rates to smooth of the demand.

Personally at the moment I charge manually when it's cheapest for me but the overall impact is not the same as heaters where everybody would be using energy during a cold spell. Today I even got about 6kWh from my solar which makes up for the painful Agile rates at the moment!