Dealing with a rogue shipping company

splinters

In April I hired a shipping company to collect from UK and deliver to Switzerland and they quoted 5-9 days on the phone. The quote via email stated delivery within 14 days but that was acceptable. I paid the deposit, they collected on the agreed date, then silence.

A week later I finally got a response and they requested the invoice to be settled so they could release the goods from the UK. I paid immediately but every few days since we just got fobbed off about delays due to logistics, customs holdups at busy times etc.

25 days later the goods are still there.

Why the delay? No idea, but between taking the booking and collection they changed company name, however, the new company explicitly states on their website they don't ship to our country.

I constantly chased this, citing breach of contract etc. but they just pleaded for patience and promised updates and delivery information that never came.

Our patience ran out and we have arranged another company to collect, but they would not reveal the collection address unless we cancelled in writing and, as per their 'terms' waived rights to any refund. I now have to pay the second company in full.

Getting the goods asap and not missing the new delivery window is essential so I had no choice but to agree under duress so they would share the address and my goods could be collected and moved on. The shipping has all our household items, small appliances and clothes etc. so we are living with basics here and out of suitcases which is causing real stress as we start new jobs in our mid 50's

What are my consumer rights at this point?

Alderbank

Who is the 'shipping company' and which country are they registered in?

Are they actually a shipping company or are they an agent who puts you in touch with shippers?

When you say they changed the company name, do you mean they changed their trading name (so the actual company is unchanged) or has the business itself changed ownership?

splinters

They are a registered shipping company in the UK and it was just a name change although the 'new' business website now state they don't ship to the country I originally booked for. Would rather not share the name just now.

They have stated via email they intend to fulfil the contract, but there is no sign of any sort of despatch in the future nor will they provide a date. By next week they will have had my goods more than 30 days but still claim this is a reasonable delay beyond their control.

marcia_

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82094703#Comment_82094703

without sharing the name, which is allowed in the forum, people can not try and find the T&C of the company involved.

born_again

Business or personal?

soolin

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82094767#Comment_82094767

This is the important question as it significantly changes any responses.

Okell

@splinters - some relevant information would be useful…

"In April I hired a shipping company to collect from UK and deliver to Switzerland…

… the new company explicitly states on their website they don't ship to our country… "

So are you in Switzerland?

Where were you when you entered into the contract?

Who is the shipping company?

give a link to their T&Cs

splinters

Sorry, been away for a few days and I was negotiating another company to collect the goods so I didn't want to risk anything if I named this company, it was a precarious few days.

They were holding my goods and would not release the address for collection unless I agreed to waive 100% of the fees which I had to do under duress.

So, to the details. I entered the contract with https://www.jackremovals.co.uk/ after they contacted me through Sirelo to quote me for the move to Switzerland. I accepted the quote a few days later which stated delivery within approximately 14 days.

In early July, as arranged, they arrived to pick up my stuff. Guy in a van, wearing flip flops to move 600 kg of stuff and he left the handbrake off nearly crashing into a nearby car (thankfully before loading our stuff). We may have thought it amusing at the time, but it was just the start of the nightmare. What they hadn't told us is that 4 days before collection, they had changed company name to https://www.forgeremovals.co.uk/ . A minor omissions you might think, except Forge explicitly state they do not ship to Switzerland. In fact they state: "If it is to Germany, Switzerland, the Nordics or further afield, we will tell you so and recommend a firm that genuinely runs that route. That is the considered version of the trade."

We didn't find this out until we paid the invoice to them and had flown to Zurich a few days after the collection as the agent in the first instance had suggested it would be 5-9 days.

A week later, after no response to my emails as Vicky, who was managing our shipping was on holiday! They then charged us excess weight from an estimated 300kg to 940kg!!! We were already in Switzerland so had no choice but to pay. They also told us clearing the invoice would release the goods for despatch. A total lie.

25 days passed of chasing them up almost daily, threatening legal action once they had breached their contract, but they pleaded with us to be patient as an update was forthcoming. It wasnt. At no time did they ever give us a a delivery date and just kept buying time with different excuses. Clearly they had no way of shipping it themselves, probably trying to piggy back some space on another vehicle without losing their profit. Desperate for our goods as we need them for our daily lives here, and fearful we might never see them, I requested another company be allowed to collect and deliver. They said OK, but that I would only get a partial refund as they had 'already done a lot of the work'.

So, I found a company, arranged for them to collect, but then they wouldn't tell me the address unless I wrote a letter to cancel the contract and waive 100% of the fees. I protested and pointed out the contract was void, not cancelled and that I was mitigating my losses. Again, they repeated they same legal lines.it was starting to feel like 'we have your goods, if you want them soon, you will have to agree to our terms' or what I might call taking my goods hostage.

With no other choice unless I wanted this to drag on forever, I wrote the letter and made it clear in the email (which they read and responded to) that I was doing this under duress as I had no choice if I wanted my goods. They just said, 'we await your letter'.

I sent it, they shared the address which turns out to be the operating warehouse for refurbishedengine.co.uk which aligns with their Romanian manager ringing me via Whatsapp from 'GreatBritDealsLtd' and getting quite angry that I doubted his integrity (the irony). He babbled on about waiting for papers from customs and that the Swiss had many holidays and that it was a very busy time.

At no point was I asked to sign anything other than a Windows note document saying these were my goods and they are over 6 months old. No 18.44 or 16a which would be required for legal transit through customs. I asked about their Swiss Agent and T1 transit documents so I could investigate the delay and he got very defensive then just changed the subject. On Monday the 10th my goods were eventually collected intact and are now on their way to me next week with all the paperwork already done….even though the Swiss are on 'many holidays'

A solicitor has helped me prepare the notice before action for breach of contract on two counts (failing to ship in the timeframe promised and not providing any date within the whole time frame), coercion under duress, withholding goods, charging (and keeping) an extra £1874 for excess weight they never shipped, failure to disclose changes in operating policies that might (and did) affect my shipping so I could choose an alternative provider. They essentially took the goods under false pretences and proceeded to make my life a misery with no way out of this mess and then tried to keep all my money while also getting nicely out of the logistics mess they made themselves. I cant help but picture them rubbing their hands in glee.

My original question was how to deal with them, but I had to first get my goods safely away from them, and then consider my legal options. I paid everything in full, provided all documentation requested, including a comprehensive inventory with individual prices and box weights. waited and gave them the benefit of the doubt until it became impossible to trust them.

Their only argument they ever provided is that these were events beyond their control, but they had the booking in April, knew they were changing name and operating policy, still collected my goods, charged a rather large bill for excess weight, failed to deliver after 25 days (when I was forced to take action) or even provide a shipping date, had no legal documents, then forced me under duress to waive my rights to a refund by withholding the address of my goods. They also made up many different stories; reregistration of vans, changes in logistics when shipping, Swiss customs and more. Our goods never left the pallet after the arrived in Dartford the same day they collected.

Total cost for this had been around £5200 which I am claiming from them, or will go to the small claims court if they don't agree to refund….which is highly unlikely after their complete lack of decency so far.

splinters

As for their terms, I do understand there can be delays, but they have to state what they are and that they are out of their control, not reregistering vans, waiting for non existent paperwork from customs. They should not have collected knowing they no longer operate that route, they cannot demand 100% fees for a job they never did, nor keep the additional £1874 charged for excess weight when it never left the warehouse.

Nor did I 'cancel' I even worded it as 'terminated the contract' which they accepted. By their terms, cancellation implies changing your mind, not voiding the contract 14 days after they failed to honour the original terms. Any legal system would expect me to intervene to mitigate my losses. Perhaps I am over confident, but they don't seem to have much going for them in the way of defending their actions?

splinters

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82094767#Comment_82094767

Sorry, thought I had responded. This was a move of our household personal goods with a registered Ltd company. However, it was all our possessions, small appliances, some furniture, a TV, kitchenware etc. and the majority of my wife's clothes. We both have senior roles in education here and have been living out of a suitcase while starting new jobs in a new country during a heatwave (the fans were also in the shipping) so pretty stressful.

The goods are scheduled for delivery now on the 22nd, meaning its 40 days since collection on an initial quote of 5-9 days and we had to cut short our summer holiday in the UK to fly back here in time to receive the goods, then lost the last two weeks of our holiday waiting for a delivery window.

To bookend this incident, I shipped my possessions here last year and took around 10 days, but was delayed at customs because I filled in the 18.44 incorrectly. This year, the second company provided both collection and delivery dates on the day I signed the contract, forms signed and checked same afternoon, and will have completed the job in 10 days so I have no idea what logistics and delays beyond their control these guys are talking about.