Utility Warehouse + smart meter

System

This discussion was created from comments split from: Utility Warehouse Charges.

blinkingmissingit

Hello I think in June 24 (or 25? ) my then 91 yr old mother had to have a smart meter installed. There was no choice about it The contractor from Utility Warehouse came in and then left saying he had to make another appointment as he was not sure he had the time to deal with two meters.

So then that took ages to reschedule but it was done. They had only installed one where there had been two. My mother has night storage heaters which is why there were two meters. The bills seem to be going up and up. She now owes more than 1000 (she has a fixed amount coming out every month) This debt is causing her stress. I have phoned up the customer service twice and that was when I was told that someone had requested coming off the Economy 7 in Sept (the Sept after the meter was changed) I told them that nobody had requested this. The first thing I noticed looking at the bill was that there was no fee on the account for the storage heaters and they told me on the phone that this meter was down as 'pending' . They said they would reinstate Economy 7 and see if there was rebate and that the one meter could deal with both accounts the cheap rate for the night storage and the day rate for everything else. Nothing happened and about 8 weeks later I telephoned and got someone who seemed very helpful. He said that the next bill would show the change and I would see a fee now charged on the second account of the bill (where since the meter was installed showed zero) / It was a weekend and he said he could not contact the department that would tell him what the difference in payment would be but that he was making a note to call me back the next day Monday - about this. Infact I was on the phone about an hour altogether this time including a call back that day. The next day he did not call me back.

On line I have not been able to see this 1400 or so owing but I can see it on the bills. I am now going to go through the bills and online and see if I can find out when this charge came in. I don't know how to proceed as the customer service have blanked this and are not giving me answers. I may have to go to an ombudsman do you think if I cant find out what is going on ? Thank you

Robin9

I have asked MSE to create a new thread to prevent replies getting mixed up.

Pleas put money aside and deal only with kWh's.

When the meter was installed - please confirm date - it would have read 0000 - and there would have been a sticker on it giving date and the old meter readings.

Is this meter change shown on her bills ? Double check that the serial number on the bill is the same as on the bill please.

What are todays readings ?

Scot_39

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82059389#Comment_82059389

Edit Note to OPs please move this is split out "blinkingmissingit" post.

Assuming you mothers NSH and normal circuits are operating as expected - and the NSH only getting power 7 hours a night (sadly meter fitters have occasionally been know to even get that wrong when faced with an old twin meter system - so probably good the first fitter didn't rush the job) it seems likely the main problem is your single rate billing.

And this is where it might get trickier to resolve.

Assuming the meter was installed and initially configured as E7 - it should have had a peak and an off peak register - to control which units of use - get billed at each rate.

Smart meters however can be reconfigured over the air - and that can stop recording the energy use by time of day - often resulting in one of the two registers freezing - whereas supplies used to often simply bill both registers at the new single rate.

So again - worth checking old bills / statements since - to see if both meter registers were left operational.

UW often had aggressively tilted off peak and peak rates - vs other suppliers - fairly recently (pre April) in some regions as little as 6/7p iirc - whereas other big 6 suppliers were more like say 12-15p - but the flip side -was their day rates c35-40p rather than c30-33p say.

If so and they agree to honour the complaint re flat rate switch - they can just I hope re-bill off of the operational registers at the correct rates.

If not your into arguments about what would be a reasonable split.

Assuming the totals are not too different - previous years off peak / peak splits would seem like a reasonable start point for negotiation.

How long has the account been with UW ? Do you have old statements ? If not can you get old data via their app or online user portal / account pages ?

So try to have your mum look around for old statements - or if you have online access set-up can you do so for her - EOn show my online register readings every month on billing data and every quarter on the 1st for cap changes ?

Given Amount - worth considering formal complaint route

Given your talking £1000-1400 excess - if largely due to "Erroneous Switch" to single rate and refund - think might be worth logging as formal complaint.

And of course - if not confident your calls will be followed up - have you formally entered as a complaint to their complaints system - ideally in writing - by email or by online chat (if that allows you to keep a log of the exchange for your records).

Beware they may have evidence of the request - so be prepared for that eventuality as well.

(Im on e10 - its more expensive than e7 - but even e7 can bemore than SR once heatig goes off. I get regular statements telling me single rate deals are cheaper in my non heat // summer months - 8-9 months of the year. Maybe a risk - no matter how small - your mum may have responded to similar ?)

In terms of last years meter fitting

Are you happy the system is operating as before ?

Are you happy the system is billed as before ?

For both the day meter and the restricted NSH use meter aspects ?

Twin meter set-ups are not all created equally - and so potentially not billed equally.

When I lost my RTS the normal day meter and the restricted metering became linked - as one tariff on one meter - I then paid premium peak and got 10 hrs off peak rates on my normal circuits - where before it was flat rate.

But for me that meant premium rate at breakfast / morning electric shower to early lunch time (peak rate 5am to 1pm GMT) and evening meal time (when peak rates apply 4-8pm GMT) - where most of my normal use was.

SO when things got expensive - I had to get really careful about avoiding those peak rate heavy demand uses - and shifting into off peaks - to move 100s kWhs and cut bills. Take a moderate length shower and cook 1 oven meal in off peak rather than peak - and I save about 40p a day - £150 a year.

Not all twin meter set-ups - behaved the same before smart upgrade - and so some - if the supplier replicates old twin set-up exactly - need a special form of meter - one that is effectively 2 meters in one box - a so called twin element meter. And some larger suppliers - as we have seen posts here - inc customers of EDF, SP and Octopus have for their customers - albeit one of those having some major teething problems with.

So do you know the exact make and model of the new smart meter fitted ?

Externally they look / wired identically - only the model / codes tell them apart.

Can you reply with the meter make/model ?

Here is a picture of post upgrade e7 meter / wiring - from another user who had there RTS replaced -

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81353610#Comment_81353610

Here is a pic of twin element meter installed - the only thing that tells us twin element - the 2E/4S - at the end of the meter bar code - below the Secure logo.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82039686#Comment_82039686

blinkingmissingit

Hello Thanks you seem to understand it really well. I now have printed out two years worth of bills from UW and I can see that around Sept/Oct last year they switched to a single rate, so instead of say 6.0 for the night rate and the night storage heaters it went to 23.00 so 4x as much for all the energy used. As well as this Mum is using a little bit more but the reason for the huge bill of 1500 over the agreed monthly rate is because of the single rate. So I phoned once and said there is only one lead going into the new meter. The guy when he came to install had wanted to put in two meters but clearly only put in one. The guy on UW helpline said that the new meters could cope with two rates (which is what you are suggesting too but that it can get stuck) and so we only needed one meter. He said that the other meter (the one that had been operating at 6.0 Kw/H showed pending and he went off to try to find out what this was about. Basically since about Oct last year the bill has shown everything begin charged at the high rate and where the meter number is for the low rate it has said, pending and O charge and O Kw/H used. So when I telephoned them again not sure how many times this is in total they said that someone had asked for it to go onto Gold or premium whatever it is called last Sept . I said that nobody had requested this and to please put it back, they said it would be put back and the refund and they did not know if a refund would be back dated but would let me know. They did not let me know. So three months later I phoned and asked again and they said that the next bill would show that this had been corrected. All the next bill showed is that the old meter for the 6.0 rate is no longer included on the bill, saying 0 use and 0 charge

So it is pretty awful, my mother is 93 it relies on someone else being around to try to investigate it. She is registered as vulnerable/elderly and I wish I had not done this now as perhaps they simply think (being cynical) that nobody is going to look into it.

I have not made a formal complaint yet, is that the next stage ? As soon as I can I will take the bills and my notes into the Citizens Advice bureau as well to see what can be done

I am slightly reassured that you imply that the two rates (economy or budget it used to be called ) are still available as I was afraid they would say it was not any more so at least it soounds as if they could change it back. Do let me know what you think, thank you

EssexHebridean

The priority services register means that the supplier has more responsibility towards your Mum, not less - it's absolutely correct at her age that she is on the register.