Civil Enforcement PCN/NTK

disgruntled01

As the keeper, I have recieved the letter attached. It’s for a “failed to obtain permit in accordance with the notified terms” - I.e. one assumes registration number not recorded properly on a tablet - on 29 May. I received it this Saturday (20th) June, well after 14 days, although the letter says it was issued 2nd June. So I guess I can not get out on the 14 day technicality.

I have tried to understand the newbie thread. If I understand correctly, the primary route is A - see if the landowner/MP can get it cancelled. The visit was to a surgery that is a tennant. The surgery are not interested, I’m trying to get the landlords details from them, but I don’t hold much hope. The MP I also hold out little hope for, they seem more interested in photo opportunities in local cafes…

The PCN/NTK suggests if I don’t pay by 28days the charge could go up. I’m aware this is a rush tactic, but guess if route A comes back unfruitful, I have to appeal anyway, in which case I may as well do it close to day 28 to appeal before they put the charge up automatically.

If I’m understanding the forum/advice, particularly the NTK wording section of https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/private-parking-tickets/#wording then it doesn’t:

• Say that the firm doesn't know the driver's details and invite the keeper to pay or tell it the driver's details.

So does that mean the NTK is non compliant? Is that my get out route?

Any advice on how to proceed would be most appreciated.

thank you.

Coupon-mad

Appeal as keeper, saying the driver will not be named. However, the NTK is missing some POFA para 9 wording (vague as that, let them guess). Add that they've not been truthful about the 'date posted' because it arrived on 20th June. Therefore you want a copy of the proof of posting that the Code of Practice requires.

(And the charge is not "going up" because the added £70 is an unrecoverable untruth which goes against the ruling of the Supreme Court).

Gr1pr

Plan A is definitely the first port of call

Next, you check if the dates and wording comply with Pofa2012, or not

If not, then only the driver can be liable

Any plan B appeal could be as keeper, or as keeper + as driver due to being the driver, if true , or as the non driving keeper

The "charge " is £100, always was, always will be, the £100 charge never goes up, its always £100

Why was the vehicle not registered inside the surgery. ? Or was there a problem. ?

Where is the location of the surgery where the incident occurred ?

disgruntled01

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82044268#Comment_82044268

Thank you. Is the POFA para 9 - no mention that I am the keeper not the named driver - likely enough to be a successful appeal? Is it worth suggesting a keying error, or asking for proof there was not a keying error (it seems reasonable to presume the driver, whomever they may be, could have made a mistake leading to the ticket, but who knows…)? Or best to stick to one thing…

disgruntled01

Thanks. I don’t think the wording complies with pofa2012 - there’s no mention or suggestion that the driver may not be me as the register keeper?

I will continue to push plan A but don’t want to miss a deadline…

Coupon-mad

Obviously plan A is first, this week.

Then just appeal with what I said.

No it's not meant to work first time but is designed to help you at POPLA, depending on their reply regarding proof of posting. That's why I put what I carefully typed!

disgruntled01

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82044315#Comment_82044315

thank you. I shall pursue plan a for now. Do I need to initiate plan B and appeal by day 28 if no luck in plan A by then?

Gr1pr

Thats correct, dont miss the deadline to appeal, but if your aim is a cancellation, then keep plugging away with plan A

disgruntled01

Hi,

I have done a bit of digging today given the radio silence from the GP and MP. I believe the surgery are a tenant on a site originally owned by Assura, who have merged with Primary Health Properites PLC.

On the laters website there’s an email for the chairman and secretary. So I guess they are responsible for engaging Civil Enforcement on their property?

On phpgroup.co.uk it says they “invest in flexible, modern properties for local primary healthcare”. Does that mean they should comply with the nhs parking principles I have seen mentioned elsewhere? Just wondering what best to say to them to persuade them to cancel the ticket…

Thanks.

Coupon-mad

Send a version of the complaint I wrote for Debbie on the other CEL thread that was repled on yesterday. Search for dim Debbie

disgruntled01

I received the following from my MP washing their hands:

Thank you for your email. 

Very sorry to hear about this fine and I do sympathise with your frustration. As a member of the Health and Social Care committee in Parliament, I fully appreciate the points you have raised.

I have had a fair few constituents contact me on the topic of parking fines recently, which has led me to write to the Department for Transport to raise my concern about predatory parking fines and ask what the Government is doing to ensure fines are properly regulated. 

I would be more than happy to share the response from the DfT with you once I receive it. 

With regards to your specific fine, I unfortunately do not think this is something I will be able to overturn for you.

In the meantime, if there is anything else I can assist you with, please do let me know. As your MP, I am here to support you. 
 

Kind regards