Solar Panels - who to trust?

roadweary

Hi,

We use 6,700 kWh per year. We're in the process of getting quotes from 4 different places. The configuration is pretty similar for all of them.

8 x panels will fit on our South facing roof. 9 will fit on our North facing roof. A battery in the realm of 9kWh of storage and a 6kW inverter.

We have a slate roof and it's a 3 storey townhouse, end terrace. About 25 years old.

The tempting FB advert took us to EVLM who are offering this based on Aiko panels and Sig energy battery and inverter at just £10,590 installed. There would be a physical survey (apparently) but we had a long video conversation and their web-based configurator quote tool is very useful.

Project Solar visited today, very salesy. They say most solar companies tend to last 5 or 6 years so their warranties are pretty much worthless. Project Solar warranty for 99 years all encompassing, repairs / efficiency of panels, any costs associated with fixing anything. Others they say use the cheapest contractors. Once they are gone, you can't get any help. If they go out of business, nobody else will touch the system they say. They buy panels direct from China, Fox batteries…..£21k!!! but I suspect, a bit like double glazing this will come back as a 'special' of 15-17k….

Ovo Solar Heating South Wales, who have ovo.com emails and Ovo Energy head office in their footers promised a quote this week but haven't come through yet. They would use the same config, Aiko panels but use Fox batteries. They say Sig Energy have had a fire somewhere and they don't trust their product.

Green Energy Solar (South Wales) were recommended to us by neighbours of our local in-laws. They've only had their system for 18 months but were delighted with everything. Companies House show them as incorporated in 2021…. From memory their system was 10 or 12k. They got some special deal with one battery free….but they only have 12 panels.

They are visiting on Tuesday.

Finally, another neighbour thinks he got his solar panels from Effective Home - with Aircon from Glow Green, but I question if he mixed the two up. In either case I'm deciding whether or not to go for a 4th quote.

—-Finally, questions. Are EVLM too cheap to trust? Or are Project Solar charging a huge premium. Obviously I don't want my roof damaged and I want decent service….but at 21k I could buy their system twice over the PS price. Any other advice please?I know we don't yet have all our quotes in…Thanks,R

Martyn1981

Hi. Just to say, if you want to waste hours and hours of your life reading negative comments, then search Project Solar and Money Saving Expert for comments. You never know, after 10yrs(?) somebody may have posted something positive for a change.

Not a recommendation per se, but I used Green Energy a couple of years ago to upgrade and expand my PV system. My needs were rather complex and weird, balancing many factors and DNO issues, and they were the only ones that were willing to look at it, and then solve it. I liked the way they priced and quoted for everything which was transparent for me.

Having very little else to compare to, I can only say I was very happy with the work and pricing.

Not trying to poo poo your plans, but north facing panels are questionable. I would certainly look into it, as going bigger on an install doesn't increase costs proportionately, so the lower generation from the N. may be worthwhile if the extra cost is proportionately lower too. Not a no, just saying have a good think, maybe get quotes with and without the N. and compare / chat on here. I'm very happy with my WNW system, but I was happy to make a 'not great' investment on it, and WNW is quite a bit better than N.

For more detailed responses, could you add what size panels/systems are being suggested, eg is the first 17 panel system ~7.5kWp?

QrizB

Aiko panels are a budget option and Sigenergy's overheating problems seem to have been due to shoddy installation practices. I will say that £11k for 17 panels (I'm assuming the panels are in the 450-500 watt range?) plus battery does seem quite the bargain.

Project Solar are one of those "I wouldn't touch with someone else's bargepole" cases. Too many reports of problems and silly prices.

I imagine @Screwdriva will see this thread shortly and suggest how much you should pay for high-end Eurener panels coupled with a Tesla Powerwall 3. I'm going to guess something like £14k but I'll let him tell you himself!

roadweary

Hi,

Very interesting, thank you! I originally enquired about the north facing roof. The south facing can only fit 7 panels. The Aika panels are 515w - actually EVLM quoted on the optimistic front that 9 would fit making the system 4.63kW 'total module power' and 4,332 kWh per year. At 18 panels (but prob would be 17) that's 9.27 kW, 6,498 kWh per year…..so I think the yearly number is using their software estimates for what it would actually generate. A screen shot is easier :)

The PS guy said his panels were 505 watts each.

Please ask away for any other details that would be useful. :)

Screwdriva

I wouldn't recommend investing in panelling a North facing aspect, as they typically underperform by around 40-55% compared to the South aspect panels.

I also wouldn't recommend Project Solar or any installer offering Signergy.

Assuming you can fit 9 X 515W Eurener panels, a Tesla PW3 based system should cost ~£10.5K installed.

Hope this helps!

roadweary

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82000421#Comment_82000421

There seemed to be the suggestion that the panels were the lower cost part of the project.

I can probably only get 8 panels on the south facing roof. Based on using 6,700 kWh per year, how do I calculate what the set up would save me please? And who should I trust to do the install. EVLM will install Tesla….and it seems many installers will….but knowing who to trust, that's the thing….

Screwdriva

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82000426#Comment_82000426

Are EVLM Tesla Certified Installers? If they'll fit Eurener bifacial panels, go with them.

I recently shared that I always select installers to use based on the following criteria:

1) How long have they been trading? More than 7 years means they survived the industry crash that happened when FIT tariff ended and will likely survive the next one. 

2) What brands are on offer? If your only options are low end brands from the far east like DMEG/ AIKO panels and Fox/ Sigenergy batteries, then I would walk away. Installers who reject the higher profit margins that these brands offer the installer in favour of quality/reliability (eg. Tesla) are rare but worth hunting down.

3) How long is their workmanship warranty? 10 years is the absolute minimum I would accept. Cowboy installers typically do not disclose this duration if lower, in the hopes that the customer remains oblivious. During this window, the installer is liable to return to your property to rectify all faults at their expense regardless of the manufacturer's warranty. This is not to be confused with MCS Certification/ HIES or RECC insurance backed guarantees etc. which are also must haves. 

4) What do their Google/ Trustpilot Reviews tell you? In the absence of a direct word of mouth recommendation, this is the only way to gauge the installation experience from others. Beware that not everything is as it may appear here, which is why I rate this the lowest among the above selection criteria. 

As long as you do not deviate from the above, you should be fine. Hope this helps clear the smog a bit.

AboutUs

Not sure how to follow forums so assuming this post links me in somehow. South Wales and in the same boat. Hope you don't mind me looking in.

QrizB

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/82000596#Comment_82000596

At the top of the thread, to the right of the "Solar Panels - who to trust?" heading, you'll see an icon which (with a bit of imagination) looks like the outline of a ribbon bookmark - I've ringed it in red below. Click on it and it should become filled in.

That adds the thread to your bookmarked ones and let's you find it again. If your settings are right, you'll get a notification whenever anyone posts a reply (just like how you get a notification of replies to threads you started yourself, or to replies that quote you [like this one does]).

Heedtheadvice

You have been getting some great responses above. Part of knowing who to trust is being able to judge the veracity of their sales pitch!!

Some of what might help you decide depends upon your consumption use profile. I.e. seasonality and daytime fluctuations

Consider most generation is over the middle 8 or so 'summer' months so a good 4kWpeak south facing system will generate most of its 4000kWh ( approx ) over that period. That could be equal or more than your 6000kWh consumption over that same period. Consider if that consumption profile is flat through the year or if winter biased. PV will not help in winter much or you diurnal pattern is 'out' all day or at home with appliance use during the day and things just ticking over in the dark hours. Dies generation periods match consumption periods.

North facing could be less than half that Southetly generation, especially on a steeply sloped roof and over much fewer months. The PVGIS software would put it in context for your own situation. IMHO North probably not worth it.

So given that you probably genetste more in summer days than you consume ( an assumption!) , maybe you should maximise South PV gen in the border months and in your case panel numbers are limited so best panels could help value of installation I.e. cost effective vs benefit for the 4 edge months of the year. Bifacial can be most efficient, maximise power panel over the area you can cover. That is a low cost element.

Winter so low generation as to not be worth considering as far as any choice is concerned. This is where a battery that will store more your typical winter consumption wins and buying from the grid it low cost via a Time of Use Tarrif. Many EV Tarrifs, not so many non EV ones but other posters might know more of what is available.

If your summer consumption and generation times do not match then the battery is very beneficial the too. Any excess ( mainly over summer) can be exported with SEG tariffs so well worth it financially so reading up on that subject's posts could pay dividends too. One idea is to use the grid as a virtual battery ( buy cheap, sell high ) but a battery and suitable inverter can be of benefit during grid outages- if you get any and need sustained power for or to help heating or power equipment.

It should go without saying that an MCS certified installer should be used and make sure that the installer can quote and work with a slate roof as that work can be more expensive. I would ignore any quote where that is not explicitly mentioned in case of breakages and the incorrect roof fittings are not used.

Local recommendations of established companies can be worth a lot!

QrizB

North facing could be less than half that generation, especially on a steeply sloped roof and over much fewer months. The PVGIS software would put it in context for your own situation. IMHO North probably not worth it.

It does depend on costs. Prices have fallen far enough that north-facing PV can make economic sense.

If (as part of a larger installation) you can put 500-watt panels on a north-sloped roof for £250 each, and those panels each make 250kWh/yr, then they'll pay for themselves in about 8 years.