Larger Garage

MouldyOldDough

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81984777#Comment_81984777

Thanks for that - we have the added "need" to go off grid or as close to as possible - simply down to a feeling that the !!!!!! may hit the fan at some point in the near future and we would like to survive comfortably

Section62

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81986599#Comment_81986599

A solar/battery system allowing the whole house to go 'off grid' is a substantially greater project than having a bit of solar to reduce your bills.

Also, the "or as close to as possible" isn't really compatible with a scenario where "the !!!!!! may hit the fan". If you can't rely on the grid to supply electricity then you need a system capable of island operation… and with enough grunt to meet the demand you expect. It is one of those "it is" or "it isn't" things.

You need a realistic figure for what it would cost to enable you to 'survive comfortably' off-grid and whether that is affordable given the level of risk of 'fan' type events. Considering the starting point of the thread - enlarging a pre-fab garage - the available budget is going to be the key thing here.

WIAWSNB

For off-grid, I suggest get a large store of solid fuel you can cook and heat with 😶

Then the generated and stored leccy should be enough for lighting, electronics, and the odd few miles in your car.

(It's not likely that the !!!! will hit any fan to that extent anyhoo…)

Emmia

Of course if the !!!! truly hits the fan, you'll also need to be self sufficient in more than just energy - food? Water? Will you actually want to drive anywhere?

casper_gutman

We have a 16-panel system and a Myenergi Libbi with a 5kW inverter and 10kWh battery. On paper the panels have a max output of 7.2kW which is more than the inverter capacity, but because of the way the panels are split between the front and back of the roof they rarely if ever exceed the inverter capacity (when they do the output is just capped briefly). In any case panels were so cheap adding a few more to get as much as possible out of the (more expensive) inverter etc. seemed sensible.

Over the course of the first year the output from the panels has been about 6900 kWh, enough to just about cover running an EV as our second car plus our domestic usage. This includes heating a small garden office and an occasional bit of supplementary heating in the house, but the central heating is gas.

The Libbi units don't offer full Emergency Power Supply functionality but can provide some power in a blackout - see Does libbi have an Emergency Power Supplier (EPS) function? We didn't bother but if you're worried about power cuts you can have it installed to provide power to a dedicated circuit running, say, fridge, freezer, your broadband router/phone, and maybe a heater for one room. The batteries would continue to charge from the solar panels during a power cut too.

MouldyOldDough

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81986774#Comment_81986774

I suppose that a small generator would make more sense for those circumstances - with a supply of fuel ?

Emmia

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81990979#Comment_81990979

Having fuel and being able to power your oven is great - but if you have nothing to cook, then a bit pointless.

WIAWSNB

WE ARE AAAALLL GOIN' TO DIIEEEEEE!

MouldyOldDough

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81991056#Comment_81991056

Did I forget to mention the guinea pig farm ?

Section62

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81990979#Comment_81990979

We live in an area with regular power cuts so invested in a decent-sized petrol generator many years back. The main reason was for lighting and keeping the freezers running (we've lost power for several days more than once). When I rewired the house (it was allowed back then) I arranged the lighting in key rooms so it was connected via a 13A plug which could be plugged into the generator instead of the mains. The generator is enough for the freezers and lighting, but although theoretically rated at 3.5kW it struggles to power a standard-sized kettle (so we've got a low power one for emergencies). Realistically you might be able to run a small microwave on a 'small' generator, but forget about a proper oven or hob.

The key thing though is organisation - you need a stock of petrol, but it deteriorates in storage so if you don't regularly use it (e.g. for a lawnmower) then you need to buy new stock on a regular basis. If you've got an EV rather than petrol car then you can't even use the older petrol in your car, so factor in disposal of stale fuel.

The generator needs to be maintained, occasionally run to make sure it still works, and you need to have the extension leads to connect the appliance(s) to the generator… and have a plan how to use them and keep them where they can be got out and set up quickly (and safely). You need lights you can plug in, and torches so you can get everything set up if the power goes off without warning. And unless the generator is sufficiently large, you need to remember to swap plugs around so you don't overload it.

All in all it is hassle using a generator unless you have a permanent installation. So there's a tendency to 'wait a few more minutes to see if the mains comes back on' before starting the set up process. Obviously, if there is a longer-term loss of mains (or planned outages) some of the set up can be done in advance, but you may find the generator doesn't get as much use as you think it might simply because practice isn't as easy as theory.

I'm planning to invest in a modest 12V/230V inverter before the Autumn. This would be enough to run the lights I've wired in on the separate circuit and would be a lot quicker to set up with a spare car battery if the power goes off. But it also means the generator will be used less.

Overall I'd echo Emmia's point. There's not much point doing 'x' if a lack of 'y' means you can't do 'x' anyway. The one thing which worries me most is the mains water supply. Much of the public supply now relies on mains-powered pumps, if the power goes off and the water companies can't deploy emergency generators there won't be many hours before people find nothing coming out of their taps. Having a big generator which can run a kettle and oven is not much use if you don't have water to cook with, even if you've stocked up on food. So stock up on bottled water too.

Also… remember to live life, rather than spending all of it planning and maintaining your survival strategy.