Does day 0 exist?

JaMhops

Received a parking charge letter in the post about not parked in a bay; I appealed as the car overhang into a de minimus strip that use to be a parking space but 75% has been taken up by digital signage (installed since the parking spaces) leaving an unusable space (for anything to park fully within); of course this was ignored BUT I received the fine on the 15th and appealed on the 29th and they have counted this as day 15 and removed the discount even after appeal. The wording was ‘if payment is received within 14 days of the date of this parking charge’. My question is should there be a day 0 ie date of issue therefore and then they would have breached their terms?

apologies if this is covered I am sure it is but I can’t find it

Gr1pr

Day 0 is the incident date

Name the private parking company

Definitely Not a fine, just an invoice from a private parking company

Any appeal window is 28 days, not 14 days

JaMhops

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81961656#Comment_81961656

I was only informed by letter in the post which was dated 2 days after the event.

it’s UKPC they state ‘uk parking control Ltd (the creditor in this regard) will accept the reduced sum of £60.00 if payment is received within 14 days of the date of this parking charge.’

If date of this parking charge is the incident date then they have not followed their own agreement by ignoring day 0?

apologies it isn’t a fine I edited the first incorrect mention but missed the other

Gr1pr

I dont believe your interpretation

They had to issue the postal pcn to arrive within 14 days if they wanted to comply with Pofa2012, 2 days to issue date is quick, no problem

You had 28 days from the service date to appeal it

UKPC had the fallback position of 7 months to obtain keeper details and get the pcn to the keeper

JaMhops

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81961680#Comment_81961680

Sorry cleaned this up as best I can:

I didn’t receive it in 2 days; they observed and photographed the car; printed/issued the letter 2days later and I received the letter 4 days after they printed/ issued the letter.

You are correct I had 28 days to appeal but they sent a final reminder on the 29th without the discount and therefore when I appealed on the 29th it paused the clock at the higher rate

I think I should have covered that they already sent a final reminder that removed the 14 day early pay discount that letter was dated on the 29th which I am asking if that means they have taken the early repayment discount off a day early (by not including a day 0) now when looking to pay it there is no discount even after the appeal as the wording is ‘right to pay at the rate when the appeal was made’

So I guess my question is should there be a day 0 for the discounted rate based on the below setting the only definition I see in the letter that the count starts the day after the issue date. How are the discount days counted / do I have a case to appeal to popla they haven’t followed the terms?

The letter additionally says:

If, after a period of 28 days (beginning on the day after this Parking Charge is given), the amount requested in this Parking Charge has not been paid in full (or we have not been informed of the driver’s name and current address), you, the registered keeper, will, subject to the conditions of, and under the terms of Schedule 4 of the Protection of Freedoms Act 2012, be liable to pay the unpaid Parking Charge. If no payment or representation is received within 28 days the outstanding debt will be forwarded to a debt recovery agency, at which point additional charges will apply in accordance with the terms and conditions of parking.

Gr1pr

I believe that you are looking for a problem that doesn't exist

The incident date is day 0 ( Incident date. )

The postal PCN was issued and probably posted 2 days later, so fairly quickly ( Issue date. )

The letter was presumed to be delivered 2 business days later, so well within the limits of Pofa2012 and their KADOE contract with the DVLA ( Service date. )

You have eventually appealed and presumably had a rejection with a popla code

You now seem to be arguing with them over not repeating the 40% discount because they say that the 40% discount has been withdrawn due to a late appeal

Their stance will be that the pcn was correctly issued and remains unpaid

I never said anything regarding a popla appeal

JaMhops

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81961728#Comment_81961728

I cleaned above to make it clearer (I think) but there own terms are that I can pay at the same rate as when the appeal was submitted; i updated above but the issue is that they removed the discount and pursued the greater amount a day early if it should include day 0 of the ‘day of issue’.

There terms state I have 14 days to pay at the discounted rate from day of issue not incident. I appealed on the same day as they removed the discount (as I included day 0 and they didn’t for the discount).

I am bringing POPLA in as I have the reference they have removed the discount prematurely by there terms (if day 0 is included) but not sure if day 0 is included in all instances ie (discount)?

I think the confusion is I understand you are providing the rules they must abide by and I don’t know if it defines anything for the discount? but I am looking to discredit it under them not following their terms… but unsure if this is a worthwhile endeavour

I confused things in my original post as I mixed the appeal in there not knowing the discount was gone early but this post and the second to last posts are clear representations (I think). the discount is gone as I think they removed it a day early by ignoring day 0 I confused this with the appeal which isn’t relevant.

Coupon-mad

But the discount is completely irrelevant because nobody pays these invoices. Nobody looks at that. The NEWBIES thread tells you not to look at the 14 day bribe.

JaMhops

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81961785#Comment_81961785

Ok; so that’s a yes to day 0 being a thing?

Feel free to delete the thread or let me know how, l understand doing the appeal how it was was the wrong thing and the misstep has already happened and I get there are other ways but they will cause me more hassle and definitely the family stress so I asked a question around day 0 being standard as there letter defines in other areas; as if it is they aren’t following their own terms making it hopefully easy to deal with it. Alongside as the signage is after the marking I am trying to confirm with the site owner what this strip is defined as and if the current contract even identifies the change to the site.

honestly their signage is clean, it’s a honey hole so there are signs either way hence going with other approaches;

Umkomaas

Unless you get a landowner cancellation, there’s no short term quick fix. POPLA is a lottery, increasingly loaded against the motorist. If you play the long game (could take 6-9 months) of ignoring a few silly letters until you receive a court claim, at which point the game is then ‘on’. Play that part by following forum advice and guidance, and you’ll get your charge consigned to the bin, and your name mentioned in the following thread. UKPC are all over it!

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6377263/dcb-legal-record-of-private-parking-court-claim-discontinuations

Don’t let this consume your life!