PCN reminder before further action - CEL

Tephra12

Hiya,

So I've requested the parish council cancel the fine and submitted them some FOI's for contracts with CEL and the playing field (Deed of dedication with the fields of trust) etc, around the 24th April. They have 21 days to repsond to that.

I've also just (today) submitted by complaint to the BPA regarding CEL's failure to comply with the code of practice. BPA says they'll resond within 21 days.

I just have a question on whether I should email CEL with the newbies template repsonse to the LBA now, or wait until the end of the 30 days to repsond, so the 23rd May?

I'm just thinking waiting will give the Parish Council and BPA time to get back to me, but ultimately i want to play this as tactical as possible.

Thanks!

Gr1pr

You are correct, email the response nearer the deadline

Tephra12

I sent the repsonse to LBA email to CEL on the 21st May, I've not heard anything back as of yet.

I managed to get hold of the parking contract from the Parish Council. Despite the contract (which appears to apply more to paid parking and not this whitelist system they have, and apparently without a site plan) giving the Parish 5 cancellations a month, they don't want to do anything. Their responses have gone from they can't do anything to - they can, but they won't.

Also interestingly, it appears the parish council took an 'incentive' payment from parking firm to sign the contract before a certain date in 2024. Nothing dubious about that.

i've recieved a response to my BPA complaint, they found CEL in breach of the code of practice but didnt say which part specficially, or what recourse, if any, there would be - so im following this up.

Finally, I'm submitting my formal complaint to the Parish council tomorrow morning, along with another letter/email to the parish councillors, football club and village hall to ensure they're all aware of the 5 cancellations a month the Parish council has but refuse to use.

Coupon-mad

"Also interestingly, it appears the parish council took an 'incentive' payment from parking firm to sign the contract before a certain date in 2024. Nothing dubious about that."

Wow. How did you find that out?!

Fancy adding an FOI request to your complaint, to require all details and minutes/records about which other pitches were received and why the Parish Council opted for CEL's bid?!

Great fightback!

How about also getting this in the local press to lean on the Parish Council to explain why they 'took a bung' and why they are refusing to use their cancellation right for patrons.

Tephra12

The incentive payments were noted on the particulars of the parking contract. I'll post the contract below.

Thats a great FOI actually, unfortunately, I've already submitted the complaint so I might hold fire on that for now - or pose that query for the press to follow up which was my next step.

From what I can tell form the minutes of various meetings, it was actually the village hall that wanted the parking management to stop irregular parking mainly from the car sales business opposite. the Hall just had to seek permission form the parish council/councillors and then the council signed the contract with creative carparks as its their land - im highly doubtful there was any real tender process.

ChirpyChicken

Please do post it up

Tephra12

I found the cluase 4.5 interesting - basically telling the landowner they cant get involved in disputes.

Coupon-mad

So, please tell the journalists to read those clauses in full because this is my interpretation of what this Parish Council has actually agreed to! Eeek!!

• Creative/CEL keeps all the money;
  
• Creative/CEL gags the Client from discussing PCNs or complaints, as you spotted;
  
• there is an initial fixed term of TEN YEARS with (except if Creative goes out of business or chooses to walk away) no termination of the agreement possible for the client in that time period;
  
• it creates a tenancy for Creative/CEL, who can even sue for trespass, and they look to be sitting tenants even if the site is sold or managing agents change;
  
• A FURTHER TEN YEARS automatically renews which is also set in stone, unless the client (or new owner) uses the 'blink and you miss it/time is of the essence' 30 day window that is set without a reminder, immediately prior to the first ten year period expiring;
  
• if CEL's VRM keypad system fails, the onus is on the (absent landlord or new owner) client to somehow know this has failed on a day-to-day basis. They are required to immediately ensure the businesses record every numberplate of patrons manually and provide that data to Creative/CEL daily, until such time as the system is restored, and it looks like that obligation is endless … but CEL has no obligation to address technical failure at all (see 6.2);
  
• CEL only has to be 'a member' of the BPA or IPC and operate 'in accordance with' the applicable AOS scheme (NB: not necessarily remain or be an AOS member);
  
• and wait: even if Creative/CEL are stripped of or otherwise lose the ability to get DVLA data, this agreement continues - and here's where it gets worse:
  
• The Parish Council 'can' cancel 5 PCNs per month but that's not free, they have to pay all cancelled PCNs in full within 21 days, at the rate the PCN stands at (which is why they are refusing);
  
• The Council has no right to terminate (except as noted above) but Creative have an exclusive right to cancel the agreement with 45 days' notice, e.g. if they aren't 'raping and pillaging' (see below linked example from a sector whistleblower**) the site sufficiently to their liking;
  
• but it reads as if termination of the agreement for whatever reason (and it doesn't seem to exclude Creative deciding to withdraw, or the Parish Council using the 'blink and you miss it/time is of the essence' short 30 day window on the ten year anniversary) means the Parish council becomes liable for PAYING CREATIVE ALL UNPAID PCNs AT THE RATE THEY STAND AT THE TIME, WITHIN 21 DAYS.*

*That's £millions (theoretically the entire 'debt book' going back 10 or 20 years because it doesn't say it limits this obligation to whether these 'unpaid PCNs' are statute barred…).

Even if it is six years worth, that is a debt book of £MILLIONS. And because these two parties are not consumers, the Parish Council is stuck with it and is every bit as damned by this ill-advised time bomb of an agreement as Somerfield was when ParkingEye sued them.

And they won't be able to sell the site with this tenant, IMHO.

** http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/12/parkingeye-employee-reveals-their-rape.html?m=1

Normally, Creative pay just £1+VAT for these astonishing rip-off rights but to rush the Parish Council to sign up, it says they'd bung them £400 to hurry up and sign the above.

I can't think for a minute that a competent lawyer looked at that agreement.

What do you think, @Johnersh?

Have I got any of the above wrong or missed anything else onerous? Looks to me like the Parish Council is stuck with this and even if CEL are binned off by the DVLA or their system crashes completely, the Council (or any future site owner for 20 years) is liable to pay without fail, EVERY UNPAID PCN which CEL can continue to generate but won't be able to post if they get a DVLA ban one day.

ChirpyChicken

What idiots signed this agreement?

1505grandad

I wonder which entity pocketed the £400 bung "incentive payment"