New probate query

beckstas-money

Hi, i’ll try to make it this quick and clear. Need help with how to proceed please

Dad passed away November last year married my mum, a week before passing did not have a will.

Owned a leasehold property outright which we’ve had valued by three different estate agents all advising £300k, £325-£350k and £350k. We do not want to sell straight away. But will probably go that route in a year or so.

Had approximately £90k in savings spread over different current accounts that has all now been transferred to mum and accounts closed.

He verbally said what he has left should be transferred to children and pensions to mum.

I will be the Administrator. Which forms do i need to start with. I keep getting told it’s not a complicated case and I don’t need a solicitor, but I feel overwhelmed.

Thank you

Brie

I think that if dad died without a will it all goes to mum. She could pass some bits along to you and your siblings but I'm not sure how easily that can be done.

Sorry for your loss.

Woodstok2000

I would suggest gettting some advice, as you shouldnt be distributing any of the estate until you have a letter of administration and have been through the correct steps to identfy all the assets and any beneficiaries.

As I understand it, if The estate is over £322k the rules are a bit different for intestacy. Your mum would inherit all personal property and effects and the first £322k. Of the remainder, she would get half and half is split equally across all children. This includes any child adopted by the person who died. It also includes any biological or adopted child the person had from other relationships.

DavidT67

@beckstas-money Rules of intestacy vary by country, so depends where in the United Kingdom the deceased resided as to what the correct distribution would be.

The beneficaries of the estate can agree a change to the default distribution using a deed of variation within two years of the death.

Don't rush to distribute assets, do ensure you comply with the law, not just the deceased's wishes, as you have personal liability.

poseidon1

OP since there is no will, use the online tool ( below) to ascertain who ( and how much) inherits from your father's estate -

https://www.gov.uk/inherits-someone-dies-without-will

You will see based on the information you have supplied and assuming the estate is in England/ Wales, your mother is entitled to the 1st £322k ( plus personal chattels) and children entitled to 50% of the excess above £322k.

If the family wish to vary this statutory split of your father's estate, this will require a deed of variation to reallocate the intestate estate, which in your case likely requires expert advice from a probate solicitor to explain potential tax consequences of doing so.

In this regard I noted your comment about selling your father's flat in future. Question therefore, does your mother not live there and if you sell what happens to her future housing requirements?

beckstas-money

thanks all for responding. I don’t think I’ve worded it correctly.

We are not trying to share up the assets. Mum doesn’t live in that property. We are aware everything goes to her and all children are happy with this. I’m just confused on what probate forms need to be completed to tell HMRC. Is it IHT205 or PA1A

Any money that has been transferred to her account has not been touched and we have kept the closing statements from the banks.

I’m the family coordinator so its left for me to sort out.

DavidT67

As noted above, if the estate value if over £325K, it is incorrect to state that everything goes to the spouse. If you are unclear of the role and responsibilities of an administrator you should seek professional legal advice.

poseidon1

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81928375#Comment_81928375

IHT205 ceased to exsist 4 years ago, the online process in this case provides an IHT checker tool embedded in the link below

https://www.gov.uk/valuing-estate-of-someone-who-died/estimate-estate-value

PA1A is the correct form in this situation to obtain the Letters of Administration( LOA) , and your mother is 1st in line to apply for the LOA, but children can also apply. The link provides a portal to calculate the gross and net estate for IHT purposes ( this replaces the old IHT 205).

As indicated by @DavidT67 and this is stressed in the strongest terms, your mother does not inherit everything. On the numbers you supplied and assuming the value of the flat averages say £322k, in theory your mother could take this as part of her statutory legacy, but then she is only entitled to 50% of the remaining £90k cash you mentioned. You will struggle with the IHT checker tool if you do not clearly understand this.

However, you say money has already been transferred to her account but not touched. Was this cash your father personally owned or from joint accounts your mother held with him? If they were not joint accounts on what basis did the bank/s transfer to her, bearing in mind there is no will to that effect?

beckstas-money

they were his personal accounts. She just went into the banks with death and marriage certificates to notify of his passing. They asked where should they transfer the money

poseidon1

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81928710#Comment_81928710

So back to my point about varying the intestacy by an appropriate deed.

If it is your joint intention that your mother inherit everything ( despite the intestacy rules), you and your siblings will have made personal gifts of your entitlements to her in the absence of a formal DOV.

You and your siblings entlements will reduce your father's transferable nil rate band when your mother eventually passes. Bear that in mind when calculating the net taxable estate at date of your father's death.

WillowLeaf

Your mum might want to make a will if she hasn't already done so.