PIP Tribunal failed...

Altior

It is obvious, and I'm just taking an independent view here. I'm not stating I am correct, but I'm fairly analytical. If your wife was able to obtain a job and execute it, one that required a level of skill (numeracy, financial acumen at al, we would have called it competency), but in the meantime her personal finances were a bit messy, that would put her in a bucket with hundreds of thousands of others, ie it's not untypical. Lots of people work for example in the finance profession and make terrible personal financial choices. They have the ability, they just don't apply it appropriately.

It's not evidence that she can no longer budget, in fact I would tilt it in the opposite direction.

What I can say is that whilst working at the post office and dealing with other people's money, her own finances were in a mess

Again this is my conclusion from the evidence that has been shared (obviously you're not in a position to share the detail). Messy personal finances aren't evidence of not being able to budget. If they were, millions of people would qualify for PIP. In my view there would need to be some evidence in regard to why she can no longer deal with other peoples' money (ie she had the competence to be able to budget, but lost it within a year).

I suppose my conclusion would be that I can see why the tribunal has gone this way (from what you've been able to share). It isn't very persuasive. A rhetorical question for me, would be why you still have a joint bank account (one that presumably your wife can still utilise without your authority).

Humbug2015

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81922828#Comment_81922828

The tribunal failed to understand a lot of things. But you only get one shot. If they fail to understand, you suffer the consequences and they have nothing to answer to.

Humbug2015

I'd like to thank everyone who has contributed to this thread.

That any of you would spend even five minutes of your time posting to give advice is greatly appreciated.

My wife is extremely grateful also.

Thank you everyone…

HillStreetBlues

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81923382#Comment_81923382

But that assumes ADHD is a straight line and always constant. ADHD can lead to stress and stress can lead to increase ADHD symptoms, a vicious spiral. Add in a factor of derepression and even previously simple tasks are harder.
Was is the important word, OP's wife isn't trying to claim PIP while doing those things, she now trying to claim PIP while not doing those things.

peteuk

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81923798#Comment_81923798

Youre missing the point, probably because it doesn’t fit your belief of what PIP should do. Which is 100% human nature.

Sadly for PIP that is how it works, and as shown through out claim. To go above this you need to prove a legal error and if you get tripped on what you believe PIP should do against what they have done, you will fail. They will look at evidence of if you can and use it against the claim you cant. Totally get your wife has a spending issue, but what has caused it? Her depression, her ADHD, her personality, her situation?. Because she can do it leads PIP to assess its not her conditions causing it,

I would take legal advice, and look at the legal error and not what you disagree with. I’ve tried to give you an insight into how PIP will have viewed it.

On a more personal level, I would stay clear of sweeping statements on this forum, as someone with type 2 diabetes it certainly wasn’t a psychological condition that caused it. Equally as someone who cleared 60K debt, life happens and it’s not all down to mental health, Your shooting from the hip, I get that, but the forum is here to help you. We will but not always give you the answer you want, if there’s something you don’t understand ask clearly rather then adding in your own take. I totally understand your angry at the outcome, but you need to move pass that and focus on the next step.

Spoonie_Turtle

I’ve tried to give you an insight into how PIP will have viewed it.

You have, but the OP is past that point now, it's now about how the independent tribunal are supposed to view things based on the law, not based on arbitrary classifications by the assessment company. The fact ~70% of tribunal appeals overturn DWP's decisions (based on the assessment companies' view) shows the initial assessment process isn't exactly grounded in what the law actually says and how it should be applied.

OP, you might find this website useful to calibrate your/your wife's understanding and expectations https://pipinfo.net/

It has a lot of case law so you can see how the law is supposed to be applied and interpreted for various activities. I would also echo the advice to seek assistance from an organisation such as the CAB or any local welfare rights advisers.

HillStreetBlues

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81924062#Comment_81924062

I agree trying to get a welfare rights involved but I wouldn't give up if unable.

nannytone_2

I think you're focusing on that one point too much. That inevitable aspect of the appeal wouldn't score enough points yo gain an award.

lots of people are reckless with money, but that doesn't mean they lack financial capacity.

peteuk

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81924062#Comment_81924062

100% but the first level tribunal has agreed with the assessment, so Op needs to move past the I feel this should have occurred and point out what legally should occur. Trying to see it from the PIP pov is part of that, understanding the potential of why the came to that decision then allows you to attack it from a legal stance. Going in with its unfair that this has happened without understanding, to some degree the why, to me doesn’t allow you to fully explore the legal aspect.

Humbug2015

Thanks to everyone for your contributions.

Please don't think there is any anger involved here. Despondency is the main emotion being felt and experienced.

I can honestly say that if I were talking about this to any or all of you in-person, you'd see that.

I'm a qualified psychotherapist and the DWP and tribunal were aware of this. I submitted a LOT of evidence to support my wife's claim, both from a personal and professional standpoint, but because she scored no points at all and this was upheld by the tribunal, then it was obviously to no avail. The judge even asked me at the end for my professional opinion on why I thought my wife suffered depression.

Anyway, we'll move on and see where we go from here.

Once again, thank you.