Bathroom leak through ceiling downstairs

AnonymouseAWD

Hi all,

New home owner so unsure of what to do in all honesty.

I've had a small leak for a couple of months I'd say. Mid-December or something. Wasn't sure if it was from the bath or from the wash basin. So had stopped using the wash basin and have carried on using the shower / bath and it seemed 'ok', even though it probably wasn't. Leaks don't just disappear.

It had created a visible water mark on the ceiling downstairs. Then randomly one day there was drops of water coming down. Not raining down or anything that dramatic. I put a kitchen bowl under to catch the drops, expecting to come back to find a whole bowl full of water. There was no water at all so it seemed it wasn't that bad.

Fast forward:
I've had a new boiler installed today.
There is a radiator in the bathroom which I've had turned off for years on end. I just didn't use it so didnt see any point it heating up.

I asked the engineer to get it up and running.

He's finished the job and everythings fine with the heating system.

He's felt a drip on his head in the kitchen. He offererd to take a look just to ensure it was nothing to do with the heating system (I didn't think it was, and also it meant if something happened it would kick my !!!!!! into getting it sorted) so he's cut a hole in the kitchen ceiling where the leak is to find leaking waste pipes I assume. But no full access to them as the bathroom is fully tiled - ceiling, side/end of bath, walls.

So I've got a hole in the kitchen ceiling.

and a leak that clearly needs fixing.

What do I do?

I've got anxiety so unsure what to do in this situation. I just want it fixed.

I've got house insurance. Do I call them?

Do I call a plumber, do they un-do all the bathroom tiles and will they put them back? Is that their skill?

I don't particularly want to refurb the bathroom but if the tiles have to come up from the floor and off the side of the bath is it worth just having a refurb at the same instance?

Any advice offered would be great please. I'm so unsure what to do!

badmemory

Intermittent leak in my case meant it only happened when the toilet was flushed - clean water thankfully. My leak was so small it rotted the floorboards before it came through the ceiling - it took years. Luckily left the joists intact. Deal with it. If they need to take the floor up it is better than you standing on the floor & going straight through. In the last month or two with mine I thought the toilet was moving when sat on. After it was dealt with I kept thinking that I could have landed up in my dining room sitting on the toilet!!!!!!!!!!!

JIL

Why would you have to take the bathroom floor up? The leak is obviously under the floorboards. You have a hole in the ceiling anyway. Wouldn't it be better to get a plumber to find the leak via the ceiling and replace and plaster that? A decent plumber will know what to check.

WIAWSNB

Hi Anon.

I'm pleased your plumber felt this drip and effectively forced action - you know it needs sorting!

I'm surprised he wasn't able to trace the source after removing that ceiling patch - if he felt a physical drip, then there surely was a wet track somewhere? So, where did it lead to?

I can see the joists are damp, but that could be 'rising' from the plasterboard rather than indicating the water is coming down from above that point - it could well be (and likely is) that it's originating elsewhere in the bathroom, landing on the ceiling, and then tracking along to that, potentially lower, point before finding a plasterboard joint it can seep through.

I take it he wasn't able to stick his head up through these holes with a torch to look at the top surface of the p'board? That's the obvious next step - a water track should be pretty obvious on that upper surface.

What to do? Commit! Yes, check your insurance for 'track & trace', I think it's called. If you have it, check the excess, and consider calling them out. Also check to see what else they may cover - it's almost certainly damage from leaks/emergency repairs? Ditto - check excess, potentially increased premiums, and decide whether to use it.

If you have it, and want to use it, great - they will likely engage the plumber and plasterer for you. If you don't, then call another recommended plumber out after explaining the situation.

(Why didn't the other guy offer to continue with this task?)

If your tiled bathroom floor is in good condition and you don't want it changed, then getting access via the ceiling it the way to go. It needs patching in any case, so a larger patch is no big deal. So let the plumber cut away, ideally along the middles of the joists, and double-ideally where the boards already meet - this will make the repair easier.

Remind us - what did you use in the bathroom again that led to the drip returning? And what didn't you use? And where is the drippy item located?

AnonymouseAWD

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81879450#Comment_81879450

So there are tiles against the side of the bath and the bathroom floor.

Through the hole in that kitchen ceiling is planks of wood. I'm not sure of any house make up as it's all new to me, however, I assumed the floor tiles would sit slightly above them on top.

There are pipes in the ceiling cut out that go through the wood then god knows what's just above those - assuming it'd be tiles.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81879479#Comment_81879479

To be fair, he is a gas / heating engineer - obviously needs some plumbing knowledge for the nature of the works etc.

As mentioned in the other quote from the kind person responding, the pipes go up into the ceiling further through some wooden planks, so that needs to be cut out or find another way to see the pipework.

There was water pooling in one area but was dripping off the pipework clearly coming from further above.

I think excess for this is around £750 having looked up documentation.

The weird thing since the hole has been cut I put the kitchen bowl underneath the whole where the water was dripped off pipework, I've used the shower consistently for 10 - 30 minutes on some occasions and no water dripping!?
There's clearly a problem somewhere.

I've not tried the bathroom sink yet since posting

I think I will try an ordinary plumber first, then I guess insurance after if that problem can't be found.

plumb1_2

so you’ve used the shower no leaks

Run the sink taps for about 5 minutes and check that without plug, then keep filling the bowl with plug in a release it a few times to check again.

If all ok move onto the wc, flush it a few times then check

Not all the pipes will be under the floor,parts of the hot/cold, soil and waste will be above the tiled floor

danrv

Is there a chance it could be condensation? Bro had dripping down a soil pipe after a repair. Turned out to be a pipe in the loft, possibly connected to the heating.

WIAWSNB

I have to say, it's almost certainly not condensation.

Anony, when you look up the ceiling holes and see 'planks', these will almost certainly be the actual floorboards of the bathroom. And, yes, the tiles will be laid directly on to them, possibly with a sheet of ply in between, but a solid sandwich layer nonetheless. So, these pipes run either under this sandwich - so visible through the ceiling - or above it - so visible in the bathroom (allowing for 'boxing') - but certainly not as a 'filling'.

Unless you want to replace your bathroom floor tiles, then you access this issue from below as you are doing. All the plumbing should be accessible from below, except for when then go up through the floor into the actual bathroom, but these would then normally be accessible from above, even if 'boxed-in'. But it depends on where, of course.

I'm surprised your plumber wasn't interested in tracing this - he'd certainly have the skills, but perhaps prefers doing 'clean' boiler work, and not ripping up floors and ceilings…

This shouldn't be a mystery. You say the water is clearly coming off pipework 'further above'? So it's coming down the outside of a pipe that's going up through the floor into the bathroom above?

Insurance excess is £750 - that sounds typical, as they know that leaks can cause a lot of damage. Ok, I'm going to suggest that the ceiling repair + skim + paint is going to be the best part of £1k. And you haven't even fixed the leak for that. If the bathroom needs significant taking apart, then, well, you know…

By all means call out an 'ordinary' plumber for his opinion, but unless he says "Got it!" pdq, then I think I'd have to suggest an insurance jobbie to sort it all.

AnonymouseAWD

Thank you.

I mean I tried running the sink taps yesterday. Just cold, and just hot and both together. No water leaking down.

Shower frequently enough since I posted / had this boiler work done. No leaking occuring. I just don't understand it. Maybe it's just pooling somewhere else now, who knows!

Attached is a the look from below. I've no idea the white filler was already there (I wasn't home when the hole was cut).
Hopefully you can see what I mean by the wooden planks.

https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/fx16tm5h8xhehi1srze79/20260217_202427.mp4?rlkey=welyt75c3vz9caismm38roczb&st=dm310b6g&dl=0

I thought maybe at 3 seconds on the left in the ceiling there was where it was leaking and the water running to where the hole is cut as that's where it dripped from but there's no running water marks towards that area. And as I'm writing this and seeing the video on the PC screen I mentioned above about the white filler, it looks like the same on the pipes coming down on the far left too anyways so nothing that's been tampered with as a result of cutting the hole.

from below 1.jpg

bjorn_toby_wilde

I’m not seeing white filler anywhere but there is some paint which has run down the pipes to the bends and what looks like silicone/caulk where the pipes come through the floorboards.

There are quite a few greenish blue patches on the pipes. Sometimes that’s from the flux left behind when the joint is soldered not being cleaned off, but it can indicate a leak.

Nothing clear and obvious but there are some damp patches on the plasterboard.

Is there any possibility that this could come from something like a misaligned shower curtain or the seal around the bath/basin? Things like that can mimic a leak because the water will find its way down through the easiest route which is usually the holes made in the floorboards for the pipework.

WIAWSNB

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81890684#Comment_81890684

Thanks for that - useful, but a mystery!

It would appear as tho' the drips have stopped for the moment. I wouldn't call anyone out until they appear again, or it'll likely be guesswork for him too.

The video shows a suspicious round dark patch at 12 seconds, but it's hardly major, and does not at all suggest drips that would have come through the ceiling - for a start there's no 'trail' coming from them.

The verdigrised pipes at 25 seconds - and your photo - are more interesting for two reasons; the 'green' could indicate regular water coming down and dripping off at these points, and I'm guessing that these two pipes are directly upwards of the hole in the ceiling? Ie, if they are the culprit, then the drips would have landed on the piece of p'board that was removed! So that would explain why there's no other obvious signs of water trails. Do you still have these pieces? It's EVIDENCE! If so, please have a look.

My best guess at the mo' is that the leak is not from inside these pipes, but is occurring in the room above, very probably from a waste pipe. The water is landing on the floor, being largely contained by all the sealant around these pipes, but is getting through around them and running down the outside of the pipes before dripping off.

Are you sure there aren't now drips on the floor directly underneath these ceiling holes?!

What to do - get an Independent newspaper, and after you have read it, lay sheets inside the ceiling voids, flat, and in every direction. And then one on the floor, directly under the ceiling holes.

Oh, and where do these pipes go to in the room above? The bath?

Go about your normal business, including bathroom.