Get A Tesla If You Want to Avoid Speeding Tickets

jimjames

Slightly tongue in cheek but it appears if you have a Tesla on finance that they aren't very good at providing details of drivers to the police.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0r44zpprg7o

Baldytyke88

But due to police letters going unanswered, the speeding driver was not identified and the company received a conviction with a fine instead.

I would assume that would mean a manager at Tesla would get points or a ban, but it does not say that.

Okell

Baldytyke88 said:

But due to police letters going unanswered, the speeding driver was not identified and the company received a conviction with a fine instead.

I would assume that would mean a manager at Tesla would get points or a ban, but it does not say that.

Why would a manger get points?

What offence would what manager be guilty of?

Okell

jimjames said:

Slightly tongue in cheek but it appears if you have a Tesla on finance that they aren't very good at providing details of drivers to the police.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0r44zpprg7o

Badly written report even for the BBC.

I wonder whether the Press Association checked other leasing companies to see how often they'd been fined

LightFlare

Baldytyke88 said:

But due to police letters going unanswered, the speeding driver was not identified and the company received a conviction with a fine instead.

I would assume that would mean a manager at Tesla would get points or a ban, but it does not say that.

nope - company just gets a monetary fine

TooManyPoints

nope - company just gets a monetary fine

However:

"Where a body corporate is guilty of an offence under this section and the offence is proved to have been committed with the consent or connivance of, or to be attributable to neglect on the part of, a director, manager, secretary or other similar officer of the body corporate, or a person who was purporting to act in any such capacity, he, as well as the body corporate, is guilty of that offence and liable to be proceeded against and punished accordingly."

[Road Traffic Act, s172(5)]

Of course it’s very unlikely a Tesla employee would fall foul of that section. I just thought I’d add it for completeness..

Woodstok2000

Okell said:

jimjames said:

Slightly tongue in cheek but it appears if you have a Tesla on finance that they aren't very good at providing details of drivers to the police.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c0r44zpprg7o

Badly written report even for the BBC.

I wonder whether the Press Association checked other leasing companies to see how often they'd been fined

Seems to be fairly well written to me. Are you contesting any of the points in the report, or just suggesting other companies might be as bad as Tesla? If so, do you have any evidence to back that up, and does it release Tesla of their responsibilities? 

Aretnap

TooManyPoints said:

nope - company just gets a monetary fine

However:

"Where a body corporate is guilty of an offence under this section and the offence is proved to have been committed with the consent or connivance of, or to be attributable to neglect on the part of, a director, manager, secretary or other similar officer of the body corporate, or a person who was purporting to act in any such capacity, he, as well as the body corporate, is guilty of that offence and liable to be proceeded against and punished accordingly."

[Road Traffic Act, s172(5)]

Of course it’s very unlikely a Tesla employee would fall foul of that section. I just thought I’d add it for completeness..

AIUI that provision is rarely or never actually used, but also for completeness, even if it were used, an s172 conviction under it doesn't carry points - see Schedule 2 of the RTOA.

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1988/53/schedule/2

I seem to remember reading that the entire Chelsea squad registered their cars to the same limited company, which proved to be an effective, if expensive way to avoid points for speeding.

TooManyPoints

Agreed.

I should have mentioned that it doesn't carry points (which was, after all, the point LightFlare was making).

The Chelsea tale is interesting. I wonder if there might have been scope to consider Attempting to Pervert the Course of Justice? I think probably not.

Baldytyke88

Okell said:

Why would a manger get points?

What offence would what manager be guilty of?

Logic? People get points because it is a good punishment. A £200 fine means nothing to some people.

"Yes, a negligent transport manager can face severe penalties, which may include the endorsement of their personal driving licence with penalty points if they were also driving, but more critically, the loss of their professional repute,, disqualification from the industry, and potential criminal prosecution".

Aretnap

Baldytyke88 said:

Okell said:

Why would a manger get points?

What offence would what manager be guilty of?

Logic? People get points because it is a good punishment. A £200 fine means nothing to some people.

<Shrugs>. Lots of offences are punishable by fines only, including nearly all which are committed by companies rather than individuals.

There's an obsession in some quarters with the idea that if a car is detected speeding and the police can't identify the driver then "someone must get the points". It's not true. It's like asking who goes to prison if the police fund a dead body and can't identify the murderer - the answer is of course nobody. 

Baldytyke88 said:

"Yes, a negligent transport manager can face severe penalties, which may include the endorsement of their personal driving licence with penalty points if they were also driving, but more critically, the loss of their professional repute,, disqualification from the industry, and potential criminal prosecution".

I don't know where you've found that text - is it AI generated by any chance?

I'm any event you don't seem to have highlighted the rather crucial words "if there were also driving" which comes after the part on penalty points, and which make it rather irrelevant to the question of not responding to an s172 requirement.

I'd also note that a "transport manager" appears to be a role that's legally required in a company which has a licence to operate HGVs, but is not relevant to running a fleet of cars. Also, how can -."criminal prosecution" and "penalty points on your personal licence" be two separate consequences? Looks like ChatGPT or whatever chatbot you are using is grabbing random bits of text from various sources and stitching then together in a way which looks vaguely plausible but is actually nonsense.

Bottom line is that there's no mechanism for an employee or director of a company to get points because the company has failed to respond to an s172 requirement.

I suppose the police could follow up with an s172 requirement addressed to a named individual rather than to the company. However if the reply was "I haven't the foggiest idea who was driving" then it would be very difficult to get a conviction. The individual would not be the registered keeper of the car, so to convict the prosecution would have to prove either that he knew more than he was letting on, or that he was the person keeping the vehicle, which means the person actually responsible for the car on a day to day basis, not just theoretically responsible for it as company chairman or similar.