Money claim for bin services

sheramber

Firo09 said:

saajan_12 said:

Several questions
1) Were you contracting as a business or a consumer?
2) What did the website / emails / phone call say about minimum term and cancellation? 
3) What did the website / emails / phone call say about delivery times? (quote, as the wording can matter)
4) When were the bins actually delivered? 
5) How long after the phone call did you email to cancel? 

Firo09 said:

Now they have made a money claim with the courts because we obviously wont be paying for services we did not use.

Depending on the above, that may not be an option. Using a product isnt' always pertinent if they largely fulfilled the contract and minor breaches don't always allow you to tear up the contract. 

1) Business
2) I think it was min term of 24 months 
3) The bin was supposed to be delivered to us at the start of october we signed up at the start of September,
the bins didnt arrive until middle of october
5) emailed the next day following the phone call

Signed up at the beginning of September   then phoned to cancel the next day?

What was said when you said you wanted to cancel?

Grumpy_chap

The business took out a 2-year contract.
What was the monthly fee?

How has the supplier determined the £3.5k that they are now claiming for the business breach of contract?

Given that the bins have now been received and, presumably, a commercial waste collection service will continue to be required, is a viable option to rescind the contract termination and allow the service provider to collect the rubbish for the period of the original 2-year contract?  Would that abort the penalty charges that are being claimed  on the basis that the normal contractual payments will now be made?

Ergates

Firo09 said:

Okell said:

Firo09 said:

... This is for my fathers business by the way and he wont be able to afford legal advice from a solicitor thats why i thought id get help here

He's being sued for the best part of £4k.

If his business can't afford to pay for legal advice when needed, he can't afford to stay in business.

(Having said that, you'd be better off posting here:  Small biz MoneySaving — MoneySavingExpert Forum

Report your own post and ask the mods to move it)

its not about not being able to afford it but why should he pay for a service he did not use whatsoever.
understand from my point…

Because he entered into a legally binding contract for him to do so.

There *may* be ways out of this - but "I didn't use the service so I'm not paying" isn't one of them.

saajan_12

Firo09 said:

saajan_12 said:

Several questions
1) Were you contracting as a business or a consumer?
2) What did the website / emails / phone call say about minimum term and cancellation? 
3) What did the website / emails / phone call say about delivery times? (quote, as the wording can matter)
4) When were the bins actually delivered? 
5) How long after the phone call did you email to cancel? 

Firo09 said:

Now they have made a money claim with the courts because we obviously wont be paying for services we did not use.

Depending on the above, that may not be an option. Using a product isnt' always pertinent if they largely fulfilled the contract and minor breaches don't always allow you to tear up the contract. 

1) Business
2) I think it was min term of 24 months 
3) The bin was supposed to be delivered to us at the start of october we signed up at the start of September,
the bins didnt arrive until middle of october
5) emailed the next day following the phone call

Thanks for the clear answers. 

The potential avenues to cancel could be: 
A ) cooling off period / right to cancel for consumers - N/A given business contract

B ) contractual cancellation terms - in the screenshot from them, they suggest a 3 / 6 month notice period. Do you agree that's what was discussed and did that apply during the 24 month term or after? That could limit your costs. 

C ) Breach of contract due to the late delivery of bins. Clearly this wasn't known when you first emailed the day after the phonecall. If they were supposed to arrive in 4.5 weeks and actually arrived in 6 weeks, that's not a huge difference. Was there a critical deadline discussed in the phonecall? Did you have any cost from not having the bins for the 2 weeks? What I'm getting at is you may have claimed the damages due to their late delivery, but its probably not sufficient to cancel the contract entirely. 

Firo09 said:

Okell said:

Firo09 said:

... This is for my fathers business by the way and he wont be able to afford legal advice from a solicitor thats why i thought id get help here

He's being sued for the best part of £4k.

If his business can't afford to pay for legal advice when needed, he can't afford to stay in business.

(Having said that, you'd be better off posting here:  Small biz MoneySaving — MoneySavingExpert Forum

Report your own post and ask the mods to move it)

its not about not being able to afford it but why should he pay for a service he did not use whatsoever.
understand from my point…

Because he agreed to pay.. usage is rarely a condition of payment, same as if you get a takeaway pizza and then don't end up eating it. 

Aylesbury_Duck

Firo09 said:

Okell said:

Firo09 said:

... This is for my fathers business by the way and he wont be able to afford legal advice from a solicitor thats why i thought id get help here

He's being sued for the best part of £4k.

If his business can't afford to pay for legal advice when needed, he can't afford to stay in business.

(Having said that, you'd be better off posting here:  Small biz MoneySaving — MoneySavingExpert Forum

Report your own post and ask the mods to move it)

its not about not being able to afford it but why should he pay for a service he did not use whatsoever.
understand from my point…

So he can afford to pay for legal advice?  Given the size of the sum involved, it would seem sensible to do so.  The argument about him not using the service is a fundamentally flawed one.

born_again

Firo09 said:

saajan_12 said:

Several questions
1) Were you contracting as a business or a consumer?
2) What did the website / emails / phone call say about minimum term and cancellation? 
3) What did the website / emails / phone call say about delivery times? (quote, as the wording can matter)
4) When were the bins actually delivered? 
5) How long after the phone call did you email to cancel? 

Firo09 said:

Now they have made a money claim with the courts because we obviously wont be paying for services we did not use.

Depending on the above, that may not be an option. Using a product isnt' always pertinent if they largely fulfilled the contract and minor breaches don't always allow you to tear up the contract. 

1) Business
2) I think it was min term of 24 months 
3) The bin was supposed to be delivered to us at the start of october we signed up at the start of September,
the bins didnt arrive until middle of october
5) emailed the next day following the phone call

How long after taking out the service was the phone call to cancel?

Firo09

MyRealNameToo said:

Firo09 said:

Okell said:

Firo09 said:

... This is for my fathers business by the way and he wont be able to afford legal advice from a solicitor thats why i thought id get help here

He's being sued for the best part of £4k.

If his business can't afford to pay for legal advice when needed, he can't afford to stay in business.

(Having said that, you'd be better off posting here:  Small biz MoneySaving — MoneySavingExpert Forum

Report your own post and ask the mods to move it)

its not about not being able to afford it but why should he pay for a service he did not use whatsoever.
understand from my point…

Does it equate to the 3 months of payments given that from the screenshot that appears to be what they told them was the notice period? 

Does he remember the call being as shown? 

They say they have a call recording so you could ask for a copy of the recording, using a DSAR if they dont agree to it straight away, to see what was discussed and agreed. 

They have sent the voice recording of the phone call yes and they do state that everything that is required legally, 

Firo09

sheramber said:

Firo09 said:

saajan_12 said:

Several questions
1) Were you contracting as a business or a consumer?
2) What did the website / emails / phone call say about minimum term and cancellation? 
3) What did the website / emails / phone call say about delivery times? (quote, as the wording can matter)
4) When were the bins actually delivered? 
5) How long after the phone call did you email to cancel? 

Firo09 said:

Now they have made a money claim with the courts because we obviously wont be paying for services we did not use.

Depending on the above, that may not be an option. Using a product isnt' always pertinent if they largely fulfilled the contract and minor breaches don't always allow you to tear up the contract. 

1) Business
2) I think it was min term of 24 months 
3) The bin was supposed to be delivered to us at the start of october we signed up at the start of September,
the bins didnt arrive until middle of october
5) emailed the next day following the phone call

Signed up at the beginning of September   then phoned to cancel the next day?

What was said when you said you wanted to cancel?

I emailed them the next day to cancel it and they stated that i am within a contract and they cant cancel it and if i do still continue i will need to pay the full fees

sheramber

Firo09 said:

sheramber said:

Firo09 said:

saajan_12 said:

Several questions
1) Were you contracting as a business or a consumer?
2) What did the website / emails / phone call say about minimum term and cancellation? 
3) What did the website / emails / phone call say about delivery times? (quote, as the wording can matter)
4) When were the bins actually delivered? 
5) How long after the phone call did you email to cancel? 

Firo09 said:

Now they have made a money claim with the courts because we obviously wont be paying for services we did not use.

Depending on the above, that may not be an option. Using a product isnt' always pertinent if they largely fulfilled the contract and minor breaches don't always allow you to tear up the contract. 

1) Business
2) I think it was min term of 24 months 
3) The bin was supposed to be delivered to us at the start of october we signed up at the start of September,
the bins didnt arrive until middle of october
5) emailed the next day following the phone call

Signed up at the beginning of September   then phoned to cancel the next day?

What was said when you said you wanted to cancel?

I emailed them the next day to cancel it and they stated that i am within a contract and they cant cancel it and if i do still continue i will need to pay the full fees

So, they are doing what they told you. 

p00hsticks

Firo09 said:

sheramber said:

Firo09 said:

saajan_12 said:

Several questions
1) Were you contracting as a business or a consumer?
2) What did the website / emails / phone call say about minimum term and cancellation? 
3) What did the website / emails / phone call say about delivery times? (quote, as the wording can matter)
4) When were the bins actually delivered? 
5) How long after the phone call did you email to cancel? 

Firo09 said:

Now they have made a money claim with the courts because we obviously wont be paying for services we did not use.

Depending on the above, that may not be an option. Using a product isnt' always pertinent if they largely fulfilled the contract and minor breaches don't always allow you to tear up the contract. 

1) Business
2) I think it was min term of 24 months 
3) The bin was supposed to be delivered to us at the start of october we signed up at the start of September,
the bins didnt arrive until middle of october
5) emailed the next day following the phone call

Signed up at the beginning of September   then phoned to cancel the next day?

What was said when you said you wanted to cancel?

I emailed them the next day to cancel it and they stated that i am within a contract and they cant cancel it and if i do still continue i will need to pay the full fees

I'm slightly confused by point 5 of your timeline. When you say 'the next day', do you mean the day after you made the verbal agreement (start of September), the day after the bins were supposed to be delivered but weren't (start of October) or the day after the bins were actually delivered ? (mid-October). 

Have you given three months notice to cancel the contract, and if so when ?