Dell Promised a Replacement Within the 30 days. But changed their mind.

theFlash

Thanks. Would I need to do all they are asking to opt for a refund do you think? I don't understand why they suddenly need all this information anyway, when they'd previously agreed to replace without any of this.

Does it matter if I initially agreed to a replacement? I only opted for this once they agreed in writing that the brand new replacement would have a new 30 day and 12 month warranty from delivery. This is before another department intervened and changed their mind on any replacement.

I'm concerned, if I continue jumping though hoops to get them to agree to a replacement that the details above will be lost. My concern is that the new system would have the same hardware faults (I'm suspecting its a batch issue based on other reports, although replacements seem to be free of the error thus far).

Are you saying that if any new replacement item has faults I am entitled still to a full refund? What if the fault becomes apparent 3 weeks later (for example)? Is it the same as having a new order where I get 30 days to return/refund?

Or then would I only have the option of a repair?

I was assuming if it was a replacement, I'd lose any 30 day replace/refund option so got them to agree to renew all warranties.

theFlash

Ive had this message from my bank today. It's good news that they are investigating, especially as I used Paypal, but the timescales concern me. Dell are asking me to photograph the machine and send my invoice to them (as if they've lost all knowledge that they'd already agreed an exchange). Do I continue dealing with them, for either an exchange or refund?

Message from bank:

We’re now getting in touch with the seller’s bank to find out what’s happened. The bank then has up to 120 days to respond to us, although we normally hear back within 30 days. We’ll be in touch as soon as we have an update for you. 

Yours sincerely, 

Visa Debit Card Disputes 

Payment Processing 

born_again

theFlash said:

Ive had this message from my bank today. It's good news that they are investigating, especially as I used Paypal, but the timescales concern me. Dell are asking me to photograph the machine and send my invoice to them (as if they've lost all knowledge that they'd already agreed an exchange). Do I continue dealing with them, for either an exchange or refund?

Message from bank:

We’re now getting in touch with the seller’s bank to find out what’s happened. The bank then has up to 120 days to respond to us, although we normally hear back within 30 days. We’ll be in touch as soon as we have an update for you. 

Yours sincerely, 

Visa Debit Card Disputes 

Payment Processing 

They are over the timescale, but that will be a internal cover all.

In the mean time you need to keep at Dell.
As they can reject the chargeback  on the basis you still have the goods.

Can  you confirm that this is a consumer purchase & not a business one?

Given the mention of "onsite service as per the Fix-on-Fail warranty." Have they not arranged to send a engineer out to look at the computer?

theFlash

born_again said:

In the mean time you need to keep at Dell.
As they can reject the chargeback  on the basis you still have the goods.

Can  you confirm that this is a consumer purchase & not a business one?


Given the mention of "onsite service as per the Fix-on-Fail warranty." Have they not arranged to send a engineer out to look at the computer?

Thanks. Its a consumer purchase.

I would never accept a repair on a brand new item, so did not agree to their 'Fix on Fail' option. It was a faulty item from opening. I reported this to their technical support department. When it was clear they were asking me to take bits out of the computer and put my own items in, I asked Customer Care what my options were and they offered a replacement or refund, as I was within the 30 days.

They had me pack up the machine ready for collection for a replacement,  then didn't turn up, changed their mind and told me they were going to do a 'Fix on Fail'. 

Now they appear to have lost all details, and are asking me to send my invoice and take photos of the machine. To do this I've had to unpack it again, which is heavy and risks damage. The machine hasn't ever been used apart from to diagnose the fault, and is still in its original packing and cellophane.

Responding to your comment on them refusing because I still have the machine - I understand they could say this, but it is only because they failed to pick it up. The bank has those emails.

 

Woodstok2000

theFlash said:

Thanks. Would I need to do all they are asking to opt for a refund do you think? I don't understand why they suddenly need all this information anyway, when they'd previously agreed to replace without any of this.  The CRA only really talks about undue/unnecessary inconvenience to the consumer, so unless it's totally unreasonable I would say you need to provide them with relevant information as requested.

Does it matter if I initially agreed to a replacement? I only opted for this once they agreed in writing that the brand new replacement would have a new 30 day and 12 month warranty from delivery. This is before another department intervened and changed their mind on any replacement.  No - you can reject outright within 30 days, or can agree to a repair or replacement. If you choose a repair you can't then ask for a replacement (and vice versa) but nothing removes your right to reject.

I'm concerned, if I continue jumping though hoops to get them to agree to a replacement that the details above will be lost. My concern is that the new system would have the same hardware faults (I'm suspecting its a batch issue based on other reports, although replacements seem to be free of the error thus far).  You need to keep track of everything and make sure its all in writing - names, job titles and dates especially.

Are you saying that if any new replacement item has faults I am entitled still to a full refund? What if the fault becomes apparent 3 weeks later (for example)? Is it the same as having a new order where I get 30 days to return/refund?  Yes. The replacement has to be fit for purpose and is subject to the same CRA rules. You'll actually be in a slightly stronger position as the CRA assumes any faults within 6 months of purchase were present at the outset,and since they've had their one chance to replace the goods you can go straight to a rejection and refund up to 180 days.

Or then would I only have the option of a repair?

I was assuming if it was a replacement, I'd lose any 30 day replace/refund option so got them to agree to renew all warranties. Its good to have the warranties, but the CRA protections still apply (and override any warranties where there is a discrepancy in terms).

My opinions in bold above

theFlash

Thanks. I've given them the information they've asked for. I've also told them that if they cannot fulfil their original agreement for replacement, I'd be requesting a refund and that they must pick up the machine at their cost.

A concern, either way, is if they collect it and they say the machine was damaged or went missing. I've photographed it, both before it was packed up in its original packing and sealed, and will photo the collection, but that doesn't totally prove what's in the box (unless I do it all live as their picking it up, which is not practical!).

Not sure what else I can do to prove its condition at the point of collection. I have no confidence or trust in them at all, as you can tell.

GDB2222

I wouldn’t worry about proof. If you do end up in court, it will be a civil case, and the photo evidence will be absolutely fine. It’s not like a criminal case where evidence has to be beyond doubt. 

theFlash

Out of interest, and hopefully not that it will happen, but if it does end up in small claims court, who makes a big company like Dell pay?

Its not like anyone can afford to send bailiffs to Texas or India/China.

MattMattMattUK

theFlash said:

Out of interest, and hopefully not that it will happen, but if it does end up in small claims court, who makes a big company like Dell pay?

If they lost in a UK court their legal team would pay out the amount.

theFlash said:

Its not like anyone can afford to send bailiffs to Texas or India/China.

The Dell that you buy off is incorporated in Ireland.

I would suggest you stop catastrophising, you are only going to wind yourself up for no benefit. 

GDB2222

theFlash said:

Out of interest, and hopefully not that it will happen, but if it does end up in small claims court, who makes a big company like Dell pay?

It’s not like anyone can afford to send bailiffs to Texas or India/China.

This is a bit hypothetical, but you can apply to the local court to enforce the uk judgement, then appoint the  local equivalent of bailiffs to go round and make a nuisance of themselves until they get paid. 

I’ve never had to do that, but I did sue Scottish Power. As far as the English courts are concerned Scotland is a foreign country, so I went through most of the steps to enforce the judgement, adding costs at each stage. Eventually, someone at SP realised that they would be silly having bailiffs at the door, and they coughed up.