Wilful negligence

ApolloHubble

..........

MattMattMattUK

ApolloHubble said:

Hi, I'm not sure if this is the right Thread but I wasn't sure where else to ask this question. My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October. It is on the market and it is insured as Unoccupied (not a cheap premium). Part of this insurance stipulates that the temperature in the house must maintain a minimum of 15 degrees at all times. Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us. Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours! I was unaware of this and had not given my consent. As you can imagine I was shocked and worried especially as the only overnight setting was for half hour at 2am. I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed, especially as the temperature had only been 13 degrees when my husband and I arrived at the house. The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence. My sister has always been someone who doesn't want to spend money. I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own. If my sister or her boyfriend put the boiler on timed again, invalidating the insurance, without my knowledge or permission, and flooded the house, the house insurance would not pay out. Would I have any rights in this case? Would this be unlawful? Thank you

No it would not be unlawful.

You post come across as somewhat over the top, houses to not burst pipes and flood at 13c, or even 5c, the pipes need to freeze. The heating does not need to be on all the time to stop that happening. The insurance stipulated 15c because that is a very safe threshold for them to get out of settling a claim if the pipes freeze.

ApolloHubble

MattMattMattUK said:

ApolloHubble said:

Hi, I'm not sure if this is the right Thread but I wasn't sure where else to ask this question. My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October. It is on the market and it is insured as Unoccupied (not a cheap premium). Part of this insurance stipulates that the temperature in the house must maintain a minimum of 15 degrees at all times. Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us. Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours! I was unaware of this and had not given my consent. As you can imagine I was shocked and worried especially as the only overnight setting was for half hour at 2am. I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed, especially as the temperature had only been 13 degrees when my husband and I arrived at the house. The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence. My sister has always been someone who doesn't want to spend money. I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own. If my sister or her boyfriend put the boiler on timed again, invalidating the insurance, without my knowledge or permission, and flooded the house, the house insurance would not pay out. Would I have any rights in this case? Would this be unlawful? Thank you

No it would not be unlawful.

You post come across as somewhat over the top, houses to not burst pipes and flood at 13c, or even 5c, the pipes need to freeze. The heating does not need to be on all the time to stop that happening. The insurance stipulated 15c because that is a very safe threshold for them to get out of settling a claim if the pipes freeze.

So you're saying that her boyfriend can alter the boiler in a property I jointly own, without my knowledge or consent, and that is lawful??

MattMattMattUK

ApolloHubble said:

MattMattMattUK said:

ApolloHubble said:

Hi, I'm not sure if this is the right Thread but I wasn't sure where else to ask this question. My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October. It is on the market and it is insured as Unoccupied (not a cheap premium). Part of this insurance stipulates that the temperature in the house must maintain a minimum of 15 degrees at all times. Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us. Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours! I was unaware of this and had not given my consent. As you can imagine I was shocked and worried especially as the only overnight setting was for half hour at 2am. I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed, especially as the temperature had only been 13 degrees when my husband and I arrived at the house. The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence. My sister has always been someone who doesn't want to spend money. I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own. If my sister or her boyfriend put the boiler on timed again, invalidating the insurance, without my knowledge or permission, and flooded the house, the house insurance would not pay out. Would I have any rights in this case? Would this be unlawful? Thank you

No it would not be unlawful.

You post come across as somewhat over the top, houses to not burst pipes and flood at 13c, or even 5c, the pipes need to freeze. The heating does not need to be on all the time to stop that happening. The insurance stipulated 15c because that is a very safe threshold for them to get out of settling a claim if the pipes freeze.

So you're saying that her boyfriend can alter the boiler in a property I jointly own, without my knowledge or consent, and that is lawful??

Yes, because he is there with the authorisation of your sister.

Is there something deeper to this as your reaction if hugely over the top?

QrizB

ApolloHubble said:

Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us.

Do you have an agreement with your sister and her boyfriend that you will all tell each other when you visit the house? If not, why would you expect either of them to have told you that the boyfriend visited?

ApolloHubble said:

Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours!

For many houses, that would be quite a reasonable thing to do.

ApolloHubble said:

I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed

Phoning the insurance company sounds a rather extreme thing to do. Their "advice" also seems flawed, unless there's a clause in the policy (that you haven't yet mentioned) requiring the property to be heated continuously.

ApolloHubble said:

The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence.

Another terrible opinion from whatever CS operative you were speaking with.

ApolloHubble said:

I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own.

Note that your sister also part-owns the boiler. She could make the same request of you.

Another matter:

ApolloHubble said:

My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October.

Do you own the house, or is it still part of your late mother's estate and the responsibility of the executors?

ApolloHubble

QrizB said:

ApolloHubble said:

Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us.

Do you have an agreement with your sister and her boyfriend that you will all tell each other when you visit the house? If not, why would you expect either of them to have told you that the boyfriend visited?

ApolloHubble said:

Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours!

For many houses, that would be quite a reasonable thing to do.

ApolloHubble said:

I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed

Phoning the insurance company sounds a rather extreme thing to do. Their "advice" also seems flawed, unless there's a clause in the policy (that you haven't yet mentioned) requiring the property to be heated continuously.

ApolloHubble said:

The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence.

Another terrible opinion from whatever CS operative you were speaking with.

ApolloHubble said:

I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own.

Note that your sister also part-owns the boiler. She could make the same request of you.

Another matter:

ApolloHubble said:

My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October.

Do you own the house, or is it still part of your late mother's estate and his the responsibility of the executors?

So if they put the boiler on timed, the pipes burst and the House insurance doesn't pay up, I am still liable to pay costs even though I did not agree to it?

MattMattMattUK

ApolloHubble said:

QrizB said:

ApolloHubble said:

Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us.

Do you have an agreement with your sister and her boyfriend that you will all tell each other when you visit the house? If not, why would you expect either of them to have told you that the boyfriend visited?

ApolloHubble said:

Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours!

For many houses, that would be quite a reasonable thing to do.

ApolloHubble said:

I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed

Phoning the insurance company sounds a rather extreme thing to do. Their "advice" also seems flawed, unless there's a clause in the policy (that you haven't yet mentioned) requiring the property to be heated continuously.

ApolloHubble said:

The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence.

Another terrible opinion from whatever CS operative you were speaking with.

ApolloHubble said:

I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own.

Note that your sister also part-owns the boiler. She could make the same request of you.

Another matter:

ApolloHubble said:

My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October.

Do you own the house, or is it still part of your late mother's estate and his the responsibility of the executors?

So if they put the boiler on timed, the pipes burst and the House insurance doesn't pay up, I am still liable to pay costs even though I did not agree to it?

The owner, be that the estate, or you and your sister jointly, would need to cover the costs of any repairs not covered by insurance.

Do you always tend to overreact and catastrophise, or is it just in this instance? 

ApolloHubble

MattMattMattUK said:

ApolloHubble said:

QrizB said:

ApolloHubble said:

Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us.

Do you have an agreement with your sister and her boyfriend that you will all tell each other when you visit the house? If not, why would you expect either of them to have told you that the boyfriend visited?

ApolloHubble said:

Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours!

For many houses, that would be quite a reasonable thing to do.

ApolloHubble said:

I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed

Phoning the insurance company sounds a rather extreme thing to do. Their "advice" also seems flawed, unless there's a clause in the policy (that you haven't yet mentioned) requiring the property to be heated continuously.

ApolloHubble said:

The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence.

Another terrible opinion from whatever CS operative you were speaking with.

ApolloHubble said:

I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own.

Note that your sister also part-owns the boiler. She could make the same request of you.

Another matter:

ApolloHubble said:

My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October.

Do you own the house, or is it still part of your late mother's estate and his the responsibility of the executors?

So if they put the boiler on timed, the pipes burst and the House insurance doesn't pay up, I am still liable to pay costs even though I did not agree to it?

The owner, be that the estate, or you and your sister jointly, would need to cover the costs of any repairs not covered by insurance.

Do you always tend to overreact and catastrophise, or is it just in this instance? 

Are you always so opinionated, even when you don't know the whole narrative? All I am trying to do is to get some advice. You don't know me.

MattMattMattUK

ApolloHubble said:

MattMattMattUK said:

ApolloHubble said:

QrizB said:

ApolloHubble said:

Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us.

Do you have an agreement with your sister and her boyfriend that you will all tell each other when you visit the house? If not, why would you expect either of them to have told you that the boyfriend visited?

ApolloHubble said:

Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours!

For many houses, that would be quite a reasonable thing to do.

ApolloHubble said:

I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed

Phoning the insurance company sounds a rather extreme thing to do. Their "advice" also seems flawed, unless there's a clause in the policy (that you haven't yet mentioned) requiring the property to be heated continuously.

ApolloHubble said:

The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence.

Another terrible opinion from whatever CS operative you were speaking with.

ApolloHubble said:

I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own.

Note that your sister also part-owns the boiler. She could make the same request of you.

Another matter:

ApolloHubble said:

My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October.

Do you own the house, or is it still part of your late mother's estate and his the responsibility of the executors?

So if they put the boiler on timed, the pipes burst and the House insurance doesn't pay up, I am still liable to pay costs even though I did not agree to it?

The owner, be that the estate, or you and your sister jointly, would need to cover the costs of any repairs not covered by insurance.

Do you always tend to overreact and catastrophise, or is it just in this instance? 

Are you always so opinionated, even when you don't know the whole narrative?

Your first post comes across as a huge over reaction and they escalate from there, unless you add more relevant context (e.g. your sister has a habit of turning off the heating, pipes freezing and bursting despite not having sustained sub zero weather), then people are going to draw logical conclusions from your posts.

ApolloHubble said:
All I am trying to do is to get some advice. You don't know me.

You got that in the first reply, it is not unlawful, you asked it again, you got the same reply, you asked it again slightly differently worded. You appear to want to keep asking the same question until you get the answer you want, rather than the answer that is correct. Your posts seem to catastrophising, they are littered with emotional overreaction. It comes across as a huge level of anxiety over what is almost certainly a non-issue and is certainly not unlawful.

QrizB

MattMattMattUK said:

ApolloHubble said:

QrizB said:

ApolloHubble said:

Recently my husband and I visited the house (it is over 90 miles away) and we found that my sister's boyfriend had been there 10 days earlier (we keep a log book) but had not told us.

Do you have an agreement with your sister and her boyfriend that you will all tell each other when you visit the house? If not, why would you expect either of them to have told you that the boyfriend visited?

ApolloHubble said:

Not only that, her boyfriend (according to my sister's instruction) had put the boiler onto timed for 5 hours out of 24 hours!

For many houses, that would be quite a reasonable thing to do.

ApolloHubble said:

I rang the house insurance and they informed me that the house would not have been insured for the period of time that the boiler had been set on timed

Phoning the insurance company sounds a rather extreme thing to do. Their "advice" also seems flawed, unless there's a clause in the policy (that you haven't yet mentioned) requiring the property to be heated continuously.

ApolloHubble said:

The house insurance also told me that this was an act of Wilful negligence.

Another terrible opinion from whatever CS operative you were speaking with.

ApolloHubble said:

I emailed my sister (so to put it in writing) that I did not/and do not give her boyfriend or any other person/s permission to interfere with a boiler that I part own.

Note that your sister also part-owns the boiler. She could make the same request of you.

Another matter:

ApolloHubble said:

My sister and I inherited my late mother's house in October.

Do you own the house, or is it still part of your late mother's estate and his the responsibility of the executors?

So if they put the boiler on timed, the pipes burst and the House insurance doesn't pay up, I am still liable to pay costs even though I did not agree to it?

The owner, be that the estate, or you and your sister jointly, would need to cover the costs of any repairs not covered by insurance.

You could consider suing the boyfriend for negligence, but it's a relatively high bar. And in the event that you were to win, does he have enough assets that you'll be able to recover anything from him?

MattMattMattUK said:

Do you always tend to overreact and catastrophise, or is it just in this instance? 

I agree with Matt that you seem to be overreacting massively here.

I've been away for a week recently. I turned my thermostat down to 7 degrees and the house stayed above that temperature throughout.

With your boiler set to run for five hours a day, and your thermostat set to fifteen, it would take a prolonged period of exceptionally cold weather before any pipes could freeze.

Baldytyke88

ApolloHubble said:

Are you always so opinionated, even when you don't know the whole narrative? All I am trying to do is to get some advice. You don't know me.

About 25% of UK homes have no buildings insurance, it's not a big deal for a lot of people. I don't have it, although I have had it in previous years.