BBSI Untaxed interest list query

badger09

Mee said:

badger09 said:

Mee said:

Hi All,

My requested list for 23-24 and 24-25 contains so many errors I really don't know where to start or who to approach first.

I requested the list because I was shocked at the interest they claimed for I earned 24-25

On looking at the list I'm finding yes they have estimated based on the previous tax year as expected, BUT in many cases this is for accounts that matured in 23-24 or closed. I think they have added at least £1k by doing so.
……………

BIB

Are you saying HMRC have finalised your 2023/24 liability based on incorrect (overstated) interest figures?
If so, there is obviously a problem. 

However, if it is 2024/25 which concerns you, you can either wait for HMRC to finalise their calculation or supply them with your own interest figures. Calculations would normally have been finalised by now but many of us, myself included, are still waiting. 

There are what I think are errors in 23/24, but yes 24/25 has lots of estimates for accounts that closed in 23/24 or matured...

There shouldn’t be any errors in 2023/24 now. Up to you whether to pursue or not. 

Until finalised, 2024/2025 will contain estimates, many of which will inevitably be wrong. As I understand it, returns of interest do not include information about account closures.  So, for PAYE coding purposes, HMRC will assume those accounts continue to earn interest. Until they are informed otherwise. 

alfista

Dazed_and_C0nfused said:

Mee said:

Hi All,

My requested list for 23-24 and 24-25 contains so many errors I really don't know where to start or who to approach first.

I requested the list because I was shocked at the interest they claimed for I earned 24-25

On looking at the list I'm finding yes they have estimated based on the previous tax year as expected, BUT in many cases this is for accounts that matured in 23-24 or closed. I think they have added at least £1k by doing so.

What concerns me most is for some banks/building societies where I have multiple accounts (some are ISAs) there is no account number, in one BS they've listed the account as 0001 (which are different accounts between the years) and in another case the multiple accounts are listed as
1SURNAME
2SURNAME 
etc.

Am I to presume that the BBSs supplied the information in that form?

The net (!) result is it is difficult for me to know where to start, except putting it into a spreadsheet and cross-checking as much as I can.

Thanks.

You can read about the process for banks and building societies here.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/bank-and-building-society-interest-returns

HMRC will eventually update accounts where no interest was reported in a later year.  Could you have got your details before this happened for 2024/25.

https://www.gov.uk/hmrc-internal-manuals/paye-manual/paye96010

I had a look at the "hmrc-internal-manuals" page and had to go and lie down in a dark room !!  

No wonder it's a mess !

RG2015

If HMRC are using too low a figure for untaxed interest in my current tax code estimate, should I tell them?

I know I can do this in my PTA online.

In fact I already did this in January, but they overwrote this with my actual for 24/25. Oh, and they got that wrong as well, but I phoned them to correct that one.

slinger2

Just to add my own experience. I'm a pensioner who doesn't do self assessment. I downsized a few years ago and have a lot of cash. In 22/23 and 23/24 the HMRC numbers for my taxable interest were very close to my numbers (within a few pounds). However when I got the 24/25 number a couple of weeks ago the HMRC number was over £1,000 lower than my count. Initially I was confused as to where the HMRC total could have come from but it works out that the difference can be explained by them not including interest from Oxbury and Trading212 (mostly Oxbury). The Trading212 interest is from uninvested cash in a trading account so is perhaps treated differently, but the Oxbury accounts are simple savings accounts. I can't think why the HMRC hasn't got my Oxbury interest. Surely Oxbury have reported it to them. Oxbury probably don't know my NI number but I'm assuming that HMRC match these things up by name and address. Anyway, my current plan is to do nothing. Maybe HMRC will discover the mistake and ask me for £200 more tax at some point.

RG2015

@slinger2

Like you, I am a pensioner and don’t do SA. The untaxed interest on my P800s for 22/23 and 23/23 was spot on but not 24/25. The HMRC figure posted on my P800 on Monday was £529 lower than mine. I phoned them on Monday and we went through the individual banks of which there were eight.

It transpired that they did not have any interest data from RBS, First Direct and Nationwide. In previous years, figures from these banks were correctly recorded.

There is no way of knowing if the banks or HMRC were at fault, but I know where I think the blame should be placed.

subjecttocontract

RG2015 said:

@slinger2

There is no way of knowing if the banks or HMRC were at fault, but I know where I think the blame should be placed.

Where's that ?

RG2015

subjecttocontract said:

RG2015 said:

@slinger2

There is no way of knowing if the banks or HMRC were at fault, but I know where I think the blame should be placed.

Where's that ?

Option 1. Three major banks with a proven track record of reporting my interest correctly all failed to report it correctly for 2024/2025.

Option 2. A government organisation, with a questionable IT system, under extreme funding pressure, experiencing severe delays in delivering their services.

badmemory

I would definitely go with option 2.  Due to the lack of increase in the personal allowance they are having to deal with more & more people, many of who have always had their tax dealt with via PAYE & now have this shambles (polite version) to deal with.  I do wonder how many will be paying too much tax on savings interest as the rates have been coming down for a while.

RG2015

Not sure if the question was rhetoric but I thought I would play along.

What would the public do if banks were as efficient as HMRC?

eskbanker

RG2015 said:

Not sure if the question was rhetoric but I thought I would play along.

What would the public do if banks were as efficient as HMRC?

That's definitely a rhetorical question!

They key difference of course is that banks are commercial organisations operating in a highly competitive market, with provisions in place (such as CASS) to ease movement between participants, so it's straightforward for people to vote with their feet if unhappy with their provider.

HMRC, on the other hand, is a monolithic and bureaucratic government agency where there is no such competition.  I'd struggle to defend them but believe that they'll be hamstrung by complex processes, outdated systems and probably an under-motivated and under-resourced workforce - with enough time, effort and money it would no doubt be possible to reform and reinvigorate the body, but because it would be such a huge undertaking, that minimises the prospects of securing enough funding, when there are so many higher priority (or higher profile) ways to spend the taxpayers' money....