Smart Parking 80 second overstay in ANPR car park

Bad_Badger_22

I've recently received a NtK for an alleged 80 second overstay in an ANPR controlled car park.

Circumstances are that the driver was visiting managed offices and allegedly overstayed by 80 seconds (by the time stamps in the ANPR photos on the NtK - the parking charge doesn't mention the alleged times or overstay, just 'paid for insufficient time (ANPR)')

I've since reviewed the signage and there is a large sign with the logo of the tenant stating 'first 45 minutes parking free'.  The Smart Parking signs don't mention a 45 minute free period.  The Smart Parking signs have the BPA logo.

I appealed on the basis that an alleged 80 second overstay is excessively keen.  The appeal was dismissed with "We can confirm that the contravention of insufficient paid time occurred as our payment system confirms that no payment was made for your vehicle registration, for the 46 minutes the vehicle remained on site."


Questions:
Should I appeal to IAS?
Should I argue at court that I was parked for 45 minutes or less - even assuming their timestamps are correct it would easily take 40 seconds each way to drive between the entrance and the parking space?
There is no signage at the entrance, but there is 15-20m inside the entrance - is this relevant?

Exodi

Bad_Badger_22 said:

I appealed on the basis that an alleged 80 second overstay is excessively keen.  The appeal was dismissed with "We can confirm that the contravention of insufficient paid time occurred as our payment system confirms that no payment was made for your vehicle registration, for the 46 minutes the vehicle remained on site."

Inevitable. If 80 seconds is 'excessively keen', where would you draw the line? 5 minutes (effectively making it a 50 minute car park) - what if someone leaves after a stay of 50m1s?

Bad_Badger_22 said:

Should I argue at court that I was parked for 45 minutes or less - even assuming their timestamps are correct it would easily take 40 seconds each way to drive between the entrance and the parking space?
There is no signage at the entrance, but there is 15-20m inside the entrance - is this relevant?

What makes you think it should only be the time your car was parked for? They only have ANPR at the entrance/exit, if that was the case it would be very easy for anyone to suggest they never parked and were doing donuts around the carpark for an hour.

Who issued the charge? What was the car park? Any chance of squashing the matter with the managed office management (or however granted permission to the PPC)? This is often the simplest way.

Car1980

What makes you think it should only be the time your car was parked for?

Because it is. Exit and entrance ANPR is the only way to record, but you can easily take 7 or 8 minutes to get to the roof of a busy Christmas multi-storey car park. And that's even before you get out and read the contract. And even if you refused the contract and left that could be another 8 minutes on the way down, so 20 minutes is actually possible.

You'll also find that a lot of car parks give you 20 minutes to leave after paying.

Car1980

Inevitable. If 80 seconds is 'excessively keen', where would you draw the line? 5 minutes (effectively making it a 50 minute car park) - what if someone leaves after a stay of 50m1s?

That's what the grace periods are for. 

5 minutes applies in most instances, and the extra 1 minute would be de minimis.

This is the car park operators problem at the end of the day, but compensated by the fact they run a very profitable faux-penalty system.

Car1980

Back to advice - don't bother with the IAS.

Smart don't run a genuine appeals process, as you have discovered.

Wait for a DCB Legal court claim, defend online and then they will simply discontinue. Guaranteed with Smart parking cases.

80 seconds is clearly de minimis, as I said.

h2g2

Or do bother with the IAS, if only to generate evidence that they systematically refuse appeals that should be allowed.

The basis of the appeal would be that the extra 80 seconds is time time spent driving from the entrance to the parking space, and from the parking space to the exit, and that this should be reflected in a grace period. Furthermore, if you can evidence the lack of an entrance sign raise that this is contrary to 3.1.1 and 3.1.2 of the sector single code of practice.

It will, in all likelihood, be refused by the IAS but it would be useful to share their reasoning anyway. And if they do allow the appeal, that's a win for you! (Although reddit's LegalAdviceUK did have a thread earlier this week of Smart Parking Ltd obtaining a "wrong address" CCJ for a 2021 PCN which had been successfully appealed at POPLA...)

Coupon-mad

I would certainly try the IAS with the evidence photo (and date/time metadata) proving the offer of 'first 45 minutes free'.

Ignore the post by @Exodi because they are completely wrong. There are grace periods. But in your case there was an alternative contractual offer of 45 minutes free parking.

Bad_Badger_22

Thanks, I'll try my luck at IAS and then await the eventual letter of claim.