What are masonery torx head screws so long?

JohnB47

I'm planning to fit a couple of windows in my brick built shed soon and the windows come with brackets, so I'm planning to use those really tough screws that don't need plugs to fasten the brackets directly to the surrounding brickwork.

What I'm seeing is that they are extremely long.

I presumed that I'd need to go into the surrounding bricks by about 3 cm or so but the shortest screws I can find are 5cm.

Is there a reason why they are so long?

tacpot12

Such fixings are often used for doors as well as windows, and a heavy door can extert a lot of force on the frame fixining. 

50mm is not that long; any regular-sized electric screwdriver should be able to driver them if they have a Torx head, unless the bricks are very tough.Most masonry screws need a pilot hole, and they definitely will in hard bricks. 

JohnB47

Thanks. I guess I was forgetting that, on many sittuations, the screws have to be driven through the actual frames, so perhaps that's why they seem to be sold in such long lengths.

In my case, they'll just go through a bracket, fitted to the window frame, that would be a couple of mm thick.

Regarding a pilot hole, I am planning to use the recommended 6mm drill bit. I hadn't imagined forcing the screw through a brick without first making a hole. I'm obviously out of date with recent developments. Does anyone remember (fibre) Rawl plugs?

Edit. Maybe I don't really need to use those hardened screws and I should just use the normal plug method? I'm just trying to make the job easier.

grumpy_codger

JohnB47 said:

Edit. Maybe I don't really need to use those hardened screws and I should just use the normal plug method? I'm just trying to make the job easier.

With normal screws and plugs you need to mark the holes with the frame with brackets in place, then remove the frame to drill the holes and hammer the plugs.

With the masonry screws you can do this without removing the frame that IMO is easier. And I used some grease and a ratchet wrench. Make sure the hole is far enough from the edge of a brick, otherwise you can split it.

EssexExile

JohnB47 said:

Thanks. I guess I was forgetting that, on many sittuations, the screws have to be driven through the actual frames, so perhaps that's why they seem to be sold in such long lengths.

In my case, they'll just go through a bracket, fitted to the window frame, that would be a couple of mm thick.

Regarding a pilot hole, I am planning to use the recommended 6mm drill bit. I hadn't imagined forcing the screw through a brick without first making a hole. I'm obviously out of date with recent developments. Does anyone remember (fibre) Rawl plugs?

Edit. Maybe I don't really need to use those hardened screws and I should just use the normal plug method? I'm just trying to make the job easier.

And making the hole with a rawlplug tool and club hammer. People have it too easy these days!

JohnB47

Thanks everyone.

ic

Don't forget also, that windows will need to stand up to wind loading in storms - using tiny screws won't help that.  I'm sure I'm not the only person who's leaned out of an open window and held on to the frame for support - I'd really hope my windows are held in with something longer than 3cm!

GDB2222

EssexExile said:

JohnB47 said:

Thanks. I guess I was forgetting that, on many sittuations, the screws have to be driven through the actual frames, so perhaps that's why they seem to be sold in such long lengths.

In my case, they'll just go through a bracket, fitted to the window frame, that would be a couple of mm thick.

Regarding a pilot hole, I am planning to use the recommended 6mm drill bit. I hadn't imagined forcing the screw through a brick without first making a hole. I'm obviously out of date with recent developments. Does anyone remember (fibre) Rawl plugs?

Edit. Maybe I don't really need to use those hardened screws and I should just use the normal plug method? I'm just trying to make the job easier.

And making the hole with a rawlplug tool and club hammer. People have it too easy these days!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZrBhAVPUyoQ