Finding out a garage is leasehold and not freehold

Tc87

Hello, just wanted to get some opinions really as to what to do . So to try cut a long story short, we are a month into buying a house with a garage and had the valuation report come back saturday saying that the garage could be a possible leasehold because its under a coach house. We were not aware of this up until the report ,as the estate agents never said on the viewing or on the listing that the garage was leasehold and the house was freehold. I rang the estate agents right away on Saturday as the solicitors was closed. They rang the seller and the seller confirmed it was . The estate agents said they weren't aware of it up until now like we were. I had to wait until the Monday (yesterday) to speak to my solicitor and the senior sales manager. So come monday ,my solicitor said yes the garage is leasehold and there are two separate title deeds on the land registry ,one for garage ,one for house. She said she had the contract which she said was a peppercorn contract and 990+ lease ,and i wouldnt have to pay anything and its owned by persimmon holmes (the coach house) . she said not to worry and the contract,searches would be sent to me shortly. I spoke to the estate agents sales manager and branch manager and they were quite rude and said basically if the seller didnt tell them  then they wouldnt know . So i said didnt they see it in the land registry deeds when they done the checks and they said no as they were only given the one title (for the house) . i said i find it hard to believe that they didnt get sent the 2nd title as well for the garage , as the first title only outlines the house and parking space infront of the garage, and the 2nd title deed Shows the garage on its own. I feel that they have clearly missed this and trying to cover up that they only received the one title. (Maybe im wrong?) But what is also annoying is , we had a offer accepted and then had a previous viewer come in and make a higher offer and we ended up putting in A offer £25,000 compared to what was originally accepted by the seller. I feel if the other person who put in a offer had known about a lease would they have put in a offer as it wasnt marketed correctly . Is it worth putting in a complaint to the higher up management of the estate agents or just leaving it? 

mebu60

You can reduce your offer if you are prepared to walk away should they not accept the reduction. 

Personally I would also want the conveyancer's assurances about the leasehold arrangements in writing.

eddddy

Tc87 said:

Is it worth putting in a complaint to the higher up management of the estate agents or just leaving it? 

What outcome are you hoping for, by complaining?

FWIW, a garage in a coach house on a modern development is never going to be freehold, it is always going to be leasehold. (A decent estate agent should have known this.)

What is it about it being leasehold that worries you?

user1977

Tc87 said:

a peppercorn contract and 990+ lease  

So what do you think is the difference in value between that and a freehold property? (hint: diddly-squat)

Tc87

mebu60 said:

You can reduce your offer if you are prepared to walk away should they not accept the reduction. 

Personally I would also want the conveyancer's assurances about the leasehold arrangements in writing.

No we don't want to walk away and dont want to risk asking for a reduction incase they decide not to sell it to us.

The conveyancer is going to send us all the relevant documents for the garage. 

Tc87

eddddy said:

Tc87 said:

Is it worth putting in a complaint to the higher up management of the estate agents or just leaving it? 

What outcome are you hoping for, by complaining?

FWIW, a garage in a coach house on a modern development is never going to be freehold, it is always going to be leasehold. (A decent estate agent should have known this.)

What is it about it being leasehold that worries you?

I just feel the whole thing has been dealt with poorly and we were already feeling lied to about the offers that were put in with the other party. 

Yes thats what i said to them ,and they just said they don't have to know if the sellers dont tell them. 

Ive never dealt with a leasehold before, we have a garage seperate to our property at the moment and its all  freehold. When it popped up in the valuation ,it worried us because we wasnt sure of what it meant entirely ,without doing some research . Also we didnt know if it means it would devalue the house or put people of buying it in the future ,who were non the wiser about leasehold garages like us.

Tc87

user1977 said:

Tc87 said:

a peppercorn contract and 990+ lease  

So what do you think is the difference in value between that and a freehold property? (hint: diddly-squat)

I have no idea to be honest and thats why im asking. I know its a long contract and basically ours but when something isnt fully freehold and has two title deeds and having never dealt with anything anything like that when it came to buying a property (this is our second house purchase) then it means 'diddly -squat* to me.

WIAWSNB

Hi Tc.

That setup is pretty standard. The garage is 'leasehold' as it's under the footprint, and is part of the fabric, of the coach house.

What practical difference does it make? None*. Financial? None. Is it an 'issue'? No.

*You will need to abide by the terms of its use, however - it'll likely state you cannot use the garage for carrying out vehicle repairs, store petrol, furniture, possibly not even add a power supply (assuming it doesn't already have one). So do check these conditions, as that's the only potential 'issue'.

Ok, and possibly restrictions on the colour you can paint the door.

And you cannot convert it.

And you'll likely have to keep it in good order.

And...

In practice, these are all sensible, and if you lived in the coachhouse above these garages, you'd want these conds too. 

gwynlas

EAs can be quite lazy in checking particulars which is why they cover themselves with all sorts of disclaimers in listings.
They might not have known about the garage/coach house scenario if it is the first time theyy have coe across it and the long lease would make it a virtual freehold anyway.
Raising a complaint would not get you anywhere or lead to a different outcome so what's the point?

eddddy

Tc87 said:

I have no idea to be honest and thats why im asking. I know its a long contract and basically ours but when something isnt fully freehold and has two title deeds and having never dealt with anything anything like that when it came to buying a property (this is our second house purchase) then it means 'diddly -squat* to me.

A garage in a modern  coach house will be leasehold. (If it were freehold it would introduce much bigger problems.)

In simple terms, a leasehold garage works a bit differently from a freehold garage...

You will be 'sharing' the coach house building with other garage owners and the flat owner upstairs. So everyone's leases will specify rules to make that process work well.

Those rules are likely to be things like...

• If the building needs repairs, Persimmon will get them done, and all the people sharing the building (including you) will each have to contribute a percentage of the cost

• The driveway to the garage is likely to be owned by Persimmon as well - so you'd have to contribute to the cost of maintaining and repairing that driveway. (That might or might not include the ongoing cost of weeding, leaf sweeping, litter picking, etc.)

• Persimmon will insure the building, and you will each have to contribute a percentage of the cost

• As a result of all of the above, you might get a bill each year called a 'service charge'

• Each garage owner might be required to do things like paint their garage door periodically in white, to keep the building looking nice for you and your neighbours

• You can only use the garage for parking a car - e.g. not as a workshop, as the noise might disturb the flat residents

You should read the lease to see all the 'rules'.


Edit to add...

In fact, there might also be an estate management charge which you have to pay each year to cover the cost of maintaining the estate as a whole - e.g. play areas, green spaces, private roads, footpaths, car parking areas, lighting, etc.

But that's nothing to do with the garage.

user1977

And bear in mind the freehold property is likely to have similar estate management rules attached to it, "rules" aren't a purely leasehold thing (despite popular misconceptions!).