Unfair Resident Parking Permit PCN Advice

FOBF_1

Hi, I have spent some time reading the Newbies Thread and searched the forum but I would just like some advice. Please advise whether my thought process is correct as I don't want to get this wrong.

 

My scenario (brief):

• I have a private parking bay at my residence, but in June I received a windscreen PCN for 'not displaying a permit'. Bare in mind it was displayed but the permit number was slightly obscured by the tint on the bottom of my windscreen (it must have moved from its position when I was parking).
• I read the newbies thread and my plan was to appeal on day 25/26. Unfortunately, I did not notice that their appeal period was 21 days, meaning that I was unable to appeal through their online portal when I tried to on day 24.
• I then decided to hand deliver a letter to their premises using the suggested template in the newbies thread. No response was received.
• Two months later in September I received the first letter to my premises asking me to pay the fine, but there is no mention of how I can appeal as the keeper.

 

As it looks like I've missed the opportunity to appeal to POPLA, it seems like the sequence I should follow is:

1. Ask the Land Owners to intervene (I have tried this but it has not been successful so far).
2. Assuming that’s unsuccessful I wait until I get a 'Letter of/before Claim' and respond following the instructions in post 2.

 

Is this correct or should I be trying to appeal to them by sending an email and requesting a POPLA code?

 

Thanks in advance!

Gr1pr

Most of your thought process is correct,  but you wont receive a popla code for at least 3 reasons 

1) it sounds like it's an IPC AOS member but you didn't name the parking company,  popla would never be an option 

2) any appeal window closed ages ago,  so no secondary appeal method is available 

3) you cannot do a secondary appeal without a rejection code from the first appeal 

jd576

What does your lease agreement (or any other ancillary agreement like a management services agreement) say about your parking space - exact wording if possible?

Coupon-mad

If it's an IPC firm just ignore their drivel until you get a claim form.

Easy to defend residential cases:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/11/residential-parking.html?m=1

FOBF_1

jd576 said:

What does your lease agreement (or any other ancillary agreement like a management services agreement) say about your parking space - exact wording if possible?

I'm renting so I don't have access to the lease agreement unfortunately. Is it worth requesting this from my landlord?

FOBF_1

Coupon-mad said:

If it's an IPC firm just ignore their drivel until you get a claim form.

Easy to defend residential cases:

http://parking-prankster.blogspot.com/2016/11/residential-parking.html?m=1

Thanks, I'll keep this in the tuck for when the time comes!

jd576

FOBF_1 said:

jd576 said:

What does your lease agreement (or any other ancillary agreement like a management services agreement) say about your parking space - exact wording if possible?

I'm renting so I don't have access to the lease agreement unfortunately. Is it worth requesting this from my landlord?

If you're renting then you have a lease agreement, right?

FOBF_1

jd576 said:

FOBF_1 said:

jd576 said:

What does your lease agreement (or any other ancillary agreement like a management services agreement) say about your parking space - exact wording if possible?

I'm renting so I don't have access to the lease agreement unfortunately. Is it worth requesting this from my landlord?

If you're renting then you have a lease agreement, right?

Apologies, yes there is a tenancy agreement but related to parking it only mentions that there is allocated parking with the property and nothing else. Is there something I should be looking for in particular?

jd576

FOBF_1 said:

Apologies, yes there is a tenancy agreement but related to parking it only mentions that there is allocated parking with the property and nothing else. Is there something I should be looking for in particular?

That's exactly what you need.

Parking easements that give unfettered rights cannot be unilaterally restricted by a landowner without an explicit variation to your tenancy agreement. This includes the imposition of a e-permit system.

Your property rights as a tenant take primacy over any agreement between the landowner and a 3rd party parking management company: this parking isn't the landlord's to do with as they wish, since the property rights are subordinate to your tenancy agreement.

So unless you have an explicit modification to your tenancy agreement (or you signed your rights away in some ancillary management services agreement), if you defend it appropriately, they're toast.

One of the pieces of case law, a Supreme Court judgement, is binding on the lower courts: K-Sultana Saeed v Plustrade Ltd [2001] EWCA Civ 2011

There's more info here citing other case law, but if you search for something like "residential" in this forum, there should be quite a lot of discussion on the topic. 

1505grandad

As Above  -  FYI:-

Even the latest unregulated CoP (soon to be replaced by a proper regulated PPCoP by the Government) recognise/acknowledge  this scam:-

https://www.britishparking.co.uk/write/Documents/AOS/Sector Code Templates/sectorsingleCodeofPracticeVersion1.1130225.pdf

THE SINGLE CODE OF PRACTICE

14

Relationship with landowner 

NOTE 3: Particular care is needed to establish appropriate contractual terms, including the application of parking terms and conditions, in respect of controlled land where leaseholders may have rights that cannot be qualified or overruled e.g. by imposing a requirement on the resident of an apartment block to display a permit to park in contravention of their rights under their lease, or to ensure that free parking periods do not breach planning consents.

FOBF_1

jd576 said:

FOBF_1 said:

Apologies, yes there is a tenancy agreement but related to parking it only mentions that there is allocated parking with the property and nothing else. Is there something I should be looking for in particular?

That's exactly what you need.

Parking easements that give unfettered rights cannot be unilaterally restricted by a landowner without an explicit variation to your tenancy agreement. This includes the imposition of a e-permit system.

Your property rights as a tenant take primacy over any agreement between the landowner and a 3rd party parking management company: this parking isn't the landlord's to do with as they wish, since the property rights are subordinate to your tenancy agreement.

So unless you have an explicit modification to your tenancy agreement (or you signed your rights away in some ancillary management services agreement), if you defend it appropriately, they're toast.

One of the pieces of case law, a Supreme Court judgement, is binding on the lower courts: K-Sultana Saeed v Plustrade Ltd [2001] EWCA Civ 2011

There's more info here citing other case law, but if you search for something like "residential" in this forum, there should be quite a lot of discussion on the topic. 

Perfect, that's good to know. I'll start putting together a series of cases that I can cite.