CPM (UK Carpark Manangement) - Arcade Carpark, Hitchin. - Appeal Rejected

95Rollers

Good Morning, been a while since I've posted - but I still read this forum most weeks and help out where I can. 

A friend parked in Arcade Carpark Hitchin, genuinely believing it was Free after 6pm. Apparently that is a common problem from what I've seen on here and Facebook etc.  She parked there for 3 hours - believing it was free due to misleading signs.  There was no signs on the entrance thus causing her to believe she was entering a free council carpark.  On double checking the signs she looked at the Parking Terms which are dotted around walls inside the carpark above car/ head level with small text.  What got her was the Term which says:

“A maximum stay of 6 hours applies from 7am-6pm Monday to Saturday”.  Next to it were signs saying "Pay On Exit" (she thought she didn't need to as she was outside charge hours).  The tariffs are on different signs  one next to the machine and the other is high up above a shed on a wall near the entrance.  There are no actual signs on entrance. When she returned to her car the carpark was near pitch black making the signs unreadable due to the poor visibility, small print and cluttered terms.  I can kind of see how people not in the know fall afoul of traps such as this.

I have added some pics of the carpark: 


Although this picture was taken some time ago, the carpark entrance is still the same. 

The tariff sign is displayed on the buildling on the left to the right above the wooden shed, but cannot be seen on entry.  There is another inside the carpark next to the pay machine - but this inside the carpark itself - which was obscured by a fence, and poorly lit meaning she didn't see the small print saying the Flat Rate of £2.50 for the night.





Here are some recent pics to show how the carpark looks after dusk and night - it is poorly lit, no signs on entry, signs aren't illuminated (nor any street lights). Various aspects of the IPC codes of practise in regards to signage, entrance, lighting and GDPR aren't followed.

Coupon-mad

Genuine question: Why do drivers use car parks after 6pm when the streets (even in major cities including boroughs in London) are mostly unrestricted by then? I would never seek out a car park on any evenings or overnight.

I'm saying this to stop the driver doing that again. There's usually no need for a car park and I don't know why anyone seeks them out. Some of my friends still do...sigh...even when merely dropping off or picking up a passenger - unbelievable! Avoid avoid avoid!

The 'appeal' won't work because there is no appeal with IPC firms. The keeper will have to ignore it and only contact UKCPM if they move house (common sense not parking law) because they must respond to a claim form.

95Rollers

Thanks. I tell everyone I know NOT to use these pits, but sadly they do. I will.send It over anyway and see what happens. As I noticed they have Upheld some of their PCNs. But unfortunately she learnt her lesson now as was naive and wasn't switched on. This carpark (like most) is full of red flags such as lack of entrance signs, poor lighting, ambiguous terms etc. I'm looking at it as a potential court defence should it come to that depending on how litigious this firm is.

95Rollers

Appeal filed on 8th Oct, they haven't responded yet - however another letter came today (30/10) - letter dated 04/10. Does it really take 3.5 weeks for a letter to arrive!??. Exactly the same as the original postal ANPR PCN with "Final Chance To Pay" in Block Capitals, plus plenty of red bold text in bullet points!   

Looks like a last dash to get the £100 fee with a textbook threatogram, where they say they will instruct Debt Collectors, and it will go up to £170. All in red text. Didnt mention the Beavis case though - maybe they realise most people can use Google now!?!

So they are admitting to partake in unlawful double recovery and ignoring the right to appeal.  Still awaiting appeal results - i don't think we'll hear from them. Certainly ain't chaing them. Bring on another day in court where they can justify themselves and imaginary costs - will cost them far more than it will cost my friend in the rare case she would lose to a clueless judge. 

95Rollers

Appeal Denied (not surprised).

Its a basically a one size fits all copy and pasted waffle-fest that includes the usual Tosh about instructing Debt Collectors and this having an effect on your credit etc etc.

"Whilst we note the comments and reason for appeal, we can confirm that the vehicle remained on site for 3 hour with no payment made to authorise your stay. We must advise that this car park is run by Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) cameras which take a time and date stamped image of the vehicle on entry and exit, measuring the length of time the vehicle remained on site. This information is then cross-referenced with the data from the payment services. Due to no payment being found, we can confirm that this PCN has been issued correctly". 

A copy and pasted response - i very much doubt it was even read and there is no mention of any of the points I argued (no signage on entrance/ poor lighting/ ambiguous terms/ not following IPC codes of practise etc) or attempts to debunk them. All they are doing is banging on about ANPR - funnily enough there was no signs to say they were capturing drivers on ANPR at the entrance or any signage whatsoever.

It offersl the chance to do the I.A.S appeal.which I can't really be bothered with - although I did see a post where someone was collating IAS decisions so I'll do one if it helps them out?! Otherwise we're gonna sit it out and wait for an LBC. I don't know how Litigious this company is, but am ready for them. 

Coupon-mad

Yes I have an IAS Decisions 2025 thread if you fancy giving this one a whirl to harvest a typical non-impartial 'decision'.

trickedAndFrstrated

I've just found this looking for info re my case. It's the same carpark.

Re the why would anyone park in a carpark after 6pm:

• I get what you mean,
• Here there isn't much option,
•  you cannot park on the road, its all one way and double yellows, 
• We thought it was free in the evening cos we've lived here 15 years, it used to be, and there never used to be ANPR
• This has all quietly been changed - its very easy to get caught out - and this is precisely the problem, we are now being asked for £100 (£60 still atm) for this reason.
• At the lower end of the carpark (to the right/east in the screen shot) there is more signage, but we parked against the road where you can drive in and park, cross the road, and not see a single sign. the ones that are on the wall to the south are obscured by other parked vehicles.
• There are no clear signs to say charges apply 24 hours, ANPR is in use, or any reminders on leaving along the lines of "have you paid?".
• Note the gap where it says "West Alley" is both the entrance and the exit.

This carpark is owned by:

HITCHIN ARCADE LIMITED

Company number 00639050

Its easy to find the directors on companies house, and a registered address. I even have a directors email address. But I have written and sent emails from 2 separate email addresses and have not had a single reply.

So I want to know whether to take this on, as in let it go to small claims court. I have precisely zero experience with this or any legal matters and am quite frankly lost in all the legal jargon. Even if I just copy paste from templates/this forum, where do i stand in caught if i don't have the legal knowledge?

@95RollersI am thinking of writing to Alistair Strathern re this carpark. I don't think there are any others like it - not to this extent - within Hitchin and personally feel that it a disgusting dark stain in our town.

I'm also planning to raise it with the ICO on grounds that there is lack of clarity and transparency, there is no prior warning of ANPR and thus no way to "opt out".

I am in process of crafting a letter to the DVLA about their enabling organizations like this to practice extortion on the countries citizens.

Coupon-mad

If you can't park on street, find a side street. There's a Council car park round the corner which would have been fine. Local authorities cannot use ANPR or operate it as a scam:

trickedAndFrstrated

context is everything,

1) we were with our kids (6 and 10) on a quick trip to the library before bed. The carpark we used is across the road from the library. The carpark above, with kids adds 15-20 minutes to that quick trip.

2) When you are in the know its easy to say. This is my first foray into this murky world of the private car-parking industry. Will I be more vigelant in future, certainly. But until this I was unaware of these practices, as I imagine are many others.