Parcel left in the rain by postman, and ruined

Flugelhorn

mksysb said:

mta999 said:

you need to ask for a refund or replacement from.the retailer

Why should the retailer have to pay for the OPs mistake?  He was the one who got the dimensions  wrong instead of checking the size and making suitable arrangements.  And how was the postman supposed to know he was going to be away all weekend?

I think this is mainly down to the OP and he should take the hit.  

postman shouldn't just leave it outside - a note should have been left and OP could have collected from the sorting office

Okell

mksysb said:

mta999 said:

you need to ask for a refund or replacement from.the retailer

Why should the retailer have to pay for the OPs mistake?  He was the one who got the dimensions  wrong instead of checking the size and making suitable arrangements.  And how was the postman supposed to know he was going to be away all weekend?

I think this is mainly down to the OP and he should take the hit.  

Because the law says it's the retailer's responsibility.

s29(2) of the Consumer Rights Act 2015:

"(2)  The goods remain at the trader's risk until they come into the physical possession of—

(a)  the consumer, or

(b)  a person identified by the consumer to take possession of the goods."

Couriers can't just leave stuff on people's doorsteps.  But if they do, the law deems it the retailer's fault.  There is no special treatment for RM

savergrant

mksysb said:

mta999 said:

you need to ask for a refund or replacement from.the retailer

Why should the retailer have to pay for the OPs mistake?  He was the one who got the dimensions  wrong instead of checking the size and making suitable arrangements.  And how was the postman supposed to know he was going to be away all weekend?

I think this is mainly down to the OP and he should take the hit.  

Royal mail guidelines say a parcel can only be left safe in a secure weatherproof location. The postie should not be leaving something on the doorstep, especially not something packaged in cardboard.

Okell

savergrant said:

mksysb said:

mta999 said:

you need to ask for a refund or replacement from.the retailer

Why should the retailer have to pay for the OPs mistake?  He was the one who got the dimensions  wrong instead of checking the size and making suitable arrangements.  And how was the postman supposed to know he was going to be away all weekend?

I think this is mainly down to the OP and he should take the hit.  

Royal mail guidelines say a parcel can only be left safe in a secure weatherproof location. The postie should not be leaving something on the doorstep, especially not something packaged in cardboard.

Do you have a link for those guidelaines?

(I'm not disagreeing - I'm certain you're right but I'd like to know for sure)

elsien

It’s under their safeplace guidance which says they can leave it somewhere safe without your consent if you haven’t nominated somewhere but it has to be secure and weatherproof.

https://help.royalmail.com/personal/s/article/Keep-my-deliveries-at-another-location-Safeplace#:~:text=If%20you%20are%20not%20at,a%20specific%20instruction%20from%20you.

Part of my ongoing dispute  with Royal mail is that I would rather they left me the attempted delivery card and I collected from the sorting office then leave it in my insecure porch. With the door wide where it can be seen from the street. (and their repeated refusal to actually use my letterbox.) 

Arunmor

Is there no personal responsibility these days? 

If householders made arrangements to receive such items it would save everyone a lot of bother and expense, its not difficult (shed, plastic/metal box etc).  Anything tricky can be covered by a post-it note on the door.

Many of us live in rural areas where a trip to the sorting office is not that easy and a failed delivery might result in never seeing the package.

prowla

mksysb said:

mta999 said:

you need to ask for a refund or replacement from.the retailer

Why should the retailer have to pay for the OPs mistake?  He was the one who got the dimensions  wrong instead of checking the size and making suitable arrangements.  And how was the postman supposed to know he was going to be away all weekend?

I think this is mainly down to the OP and he should take the hit.  

That is bad advice; the RM have a mechanism for being unable to deliver an item, ie. they leave a card for it to be collected.

The OP's contract is with the retailer and the courier is the retailer's agent; therefore it's the retailer's job to sort it out.

la531983

And this is why everyone should get a Ring doorbell so they can liaise with callers to the door about where to leave things

Exodi

Okell said:

mksysb said:

mta999 said:

you need to ask for a refund or replacement from.the retailer

Why should the retailer have to pay for the OPs mistake?  He was the one who got the dimensions  wrong instead of checking the size and making suitable arrangements.  And how was the postman supposed to know he was going to be away all weekend?

I think this is mainly down to the OP and he should take the hit.  

Because the law says it's the retailer's responsibility.

s29(2) of the Consumer Rights Act 2015:

"(2)  The goods remain at the trader's risk until they come into the physical possession of—

(a)  the consumer, or

(b)  a person identified by the consumer to take possession of the goods."

Couriers can't just leave stuff on people's doorsteps.  But if they do, the law deems it the retailer's fault.  There is no special treatment for RM

Since this legislation was inevitably going to be posted, as it always is, I'd like to continue the cycle by pointing out that goods posted through the letterbox (as the OP hoped) would also not be 'into the physical possession of the consumer', if you are interpreting it as literally putting the item in the consumers hands. Even in that case, a postman couldn't be sure that the person that they were handing the goods to was 'the consumer' as per the contract -  I would presumably be valid in arguing that by handing my parcel to my wife at the doorstep, the delivery was not compliant with the legislation. Perhaps they should also perform doorstop ID checks? Or if we're interpreting physical possession as on the property, then we can all make guesses about what is acceptable or not - Letterbox OK but doorstep not? What about in a shed? Or does it have to be inside the house? So an external letterbox is not OK? No wait, maybe it needs to be secured for it to count? But then what about if you post it through the letterbox, but the front door was unlocked? And a whole host of other silly situations interpreting this legislation at face value (e.g. My HelloFresh food delivery would spoil if allowed to return back to depot).

Fortunately for the OP, citing the (frankly outdated) legislation above, is usually a quick and easy way to get a refund and a fan-favourite of this forum.

Flugelhorn said:

mksysb said:

mta999 said:

you need to ask for a refund or replacement from.the retailer

Why should the retailer have to pay for the OPs mistake?  He was the one who got the dimensions  wrong instead of checking the size and making suitable arrangements.  And how was the postman supposed to know he was going to be away all weekend?

I think this is mainly down to the OP and he should take the hit.  

postman shouldn't just leave it outside - a note should have been left and OP could have collected from the sorting office

Speak for yourself! I quite like the fact I don't need to drive to Timbuktu and park 2 miles away (because the sorting offices never have parking outside) to collect every attempted delivery. It's OK for people sat at home all day, but for people that work your typical Monday to Friday 9-5, it's virtually impossible to ever be in for delivery unless you take a day off work or try to line it up at the weekend to sit in and wait for it.

I greatly appreciate that my parcels are left round the side of my house (or on my doorstep). Though I also have a video doorbell and my neighbours number so if it looked like a delicate parcel was likely to be left on the doorstep in the pouring rain, I'd take action to prevent it.

Likewise, I'm not sure I'd order something to be delivered to my house if I was away for the weekend. Even if it wasn't pouring hard, I'm not sure it's a good idea having an item left on the doorstep for several days in a row ...

born_again

la531983 said:

And this is why everyone should get a Ring doorbell so they can liaise with callers to the door about where to leave things

Plenty of other brands that will do exactly the same for far less & no subscription 👍