MET PCN at Mcdonalds - Occupants left premises (POPLA successful !)

eldn

The_Slithy_Tove said:

Where was the clear signage stating that CCTV footage may be used to track individuals (not just the cars) for use in parking enforcement? Bet there was no such signage (a sign simply saying CCTV in use is probably not sufficient). Which would put both McD's and Met on the back foot when you complain to the ICO about use of such footage without either warning or consent.

That's a good point, it's not mentioned. I saw on Google Images some McDonald's signage that explicitly mentions ANPR but the one in that case does not even include that, although I do see ANPR-like cameras at entry/exit. However the CCTV thing, belonging to McDonald's I guess rather than this PPC, is another beast. If they are used at all for parking, it should be written somewhere at least but that's not the case.

I checked on Google Maps and it seems that an old photo from 2017 shows that there was mention of cameras on the parking signage but the current signage does not include it. 

Ralph-y

"I have already tried Plan A: complaint to McDonalds but they didn't even bother to read what I said, " I suspect that 'Sad Mc's' are just a tenant on a retail park .... where is this retail park ? was / is there a totem sign at the entrance ? if so the owners / agents name will be on such

Car1980

They'll be a franchisee. Their details will be next to the counter.

paulstevens64

To keep on with plan A, This is what I did to help a friend. Obviously the circumstances/story needs to be altered, but this was a retail park, where the initial fob off was "we do not own the car park, or have any relationship with the parking company"

The below seemed to push them into action, and we received a cancellation notice from Smart Parking. So they were able (probably via the landlord) to get the ticket cancelled.

Alistair.Macrow@uk.mcd.com

Mcdonalds CEO

 

 

Dear Alistair,

I am writing to complain about three parking tickets that I have received, as a consequence of visiting, and spending money in one of your restaurants. 

 

Please see attached copies of the charges. In total I now face a demand for £510.00, just for being a customer of your restaurants.

 

As I have moved address twice in the last 18 months, these notices were sent to an old address, and I have only become aware of them this week.

 

I am now being threatened with court action and a CCJ, as you can imagine it is a worrying situation.

 

I have attached bank statements to demonstrate my custom at your restaurant at the relevant times. Where I was a customer spending money, and working (I am a teacher and was marking end of year exams).

At no time did any of your staff point out to me that there was a time restriction in the car park of this restaurant and continued to serve me beyond the maximum stay time. Moreover, your car park management company is at fault for unfair signage and now entrapment.

I was in your establishment as I needed space to spread out and mark dozens and dozens of exam papers (across multiple days). I would leave work following a very full and busy day, in the early evening and head to your establishment to make use of one of the many available larger tables and stayed late into the night.

Given that I can no longer appeal to the parking company, as the notices were sent to an out of date address, can I please ask that you, as the principle contractor, compel Smart Parking ltd (your contracted supplier) to cancel the tickets.

-

Just to remind you, McDonalds UK's Mission Statement is:

 

"We serve delicious food people feel good about eating, with convenient locations and hours and affordable prices, and by working hard to offer the speed, choice and personalization our customers expect. "

 

I am unconvinced that exposing regular customers to threats of multiple £170 parking charges, and worrying threats of Court Action and County Court Judgements fits in with this Mission Statement.

 

Likewise, your Core Values are:

 

Serve: We put our guests and people first

Integrity: We do the right thing

Community: We are good neighbours

Again, I feel that my current position is not one that accords with your Core Values. 

I therefore ask you to please exercise your contractual right with Smart Parking ltd, and cancel the attached, unfair, predatory parking tickets.

 

Yours sincerely

eldn

Thank you for this email, I will try that way too!

FYI this is not a retail park, this is the McDo alone. Although I sent them the details about the PCN being for "leaving the premises while vehicle remained parked", they replied to me about ANPR and overstaying, clearly they didn't even bother reading what I sent. Here is the response from McDonald's FYI:

We've introduced parking restrictions at some of our restaurants to make sure there are always parking spaces available for customers.
 
We appreciate that some visits such as birthday parties or large group visits might take longer and the parking restrictions aren't intended to stop this. If you think your stay will exceed the stated maximum parking time then please speak to a manager in advance.
 
Your number plate is scanned by our Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) system when you enter our car park, and then again when you leave. If you have overstayed the maximum time allowed, you will not be notified straight away- a Parking Charge Notice will be sent to you via the post.
 
If you feel that a Parking Charge Notice has been issued in error, please contact our approved contractors who issued the charge in order to appeal the charge. Unfortunately McDonald's are unable to revoke parking tickets- the outcome of the appeal is final and cannot be overturned by McDonald’s.

paulstevens64

eldn said:

Thank you for this email, I will try that way too!

FYI this is not a retail park, this is the McDo in east london cainning town. Although I sent them the details about the PCN being for "leaving the premises while vehicle remained parked", they replied to me about ANPR and overstaying, clearly they didn't even bother reading what I sent. Here is the response from McDonald's FYI:

We've introduced parking restrictions at some of our restaurants to make sure there are always parking spaces available for customers.
 
We appreciate that some visits such as birthday parties or large group visits might take longer and the parking restrictions aren't intended to stop this. If you think your stay will exceed the stated maximum parking time then please speak to a manager in advance.
 
Your number plate is scanned by our Automatic Number Plate Recognition (ANPR) system when you enter our car park, and then again when you leave. If you have overstayed the maximum time allowed, you will not be notified straight away- a Parking Charge Notice will be sent to you via the post.
 
If you feel that a Parking Charge Notice has been issued in error, please contact our approved contractors who issued the charge in order to appeal the charge. Unfortunately McDonald's are unable to revoke parking tickets- the outcome of the appeal is final and cannot be overturned by McDonald’s.

The bit in BOLD is not true. No company the size of McDonalds would be naïve enough to sign a contract with a parking company that takes all control way from themselves, and allows a third party to "fine" their customers!

eldn

Emailing the CEO didn't work, the email was forwarded to a customer service guy and what's amazing is that, they confirmed they received my email from the CEO office, so I was confident they would provide at least a smart answer but instead, they still told me that they cannot do anything if i OVERSTAYED. Unbelievable, they once again tell me about overstaying while my message was not about that, the PCN was not about that and nothing was about that. 

At this point, I believe this is not about if they can do anything or not but if they can just properly read emails...

Anyway, I'm sending the MET appeal , although rejection is expected on that one and hopefully will get a better outcome from POPLA.

eldn

By the way, although this is not a central point (yet), just in case they pull out a CCTV footage or anything like, I notice that McDonald's use different type of signage depending on the place.
The one at my branch is like this one (but 90 minute instead of 60min) but without the bottom part which says "Parking Enforcement in Operation".

Basically, the only part where it mentions any CCTV in use is the text at the end of the top panel, which is written in extremely small characters that can't be read with naked eyes when standing below the signage. And there is also the tiny yellow triangle at the end.

Is that legal? Shouldn't it be very visible that CCTV is in use like the bottom part on the photo below? If that bottom part is not present, I feel they are doing on purpose to put it in such small characters.

Some other signage used by McDo more clearly mentions the CCTV at the top of the panel with an icon of a camera but on mine, it's like below without any clearly readable text.

Coupon-mad

Signs like that are OK. Can you post your signage pics here please, with the date taken and the town?

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6463361/parking-code-evidence-your-images-of-private-parking-signs-are-needed-please#latest

paulstevens64

eldn said:

Emailing the CEO didn't work, the email was forwarded to a customer service guy and what's amazing is that, they confirmed they received my email from the CEO office, so I was confident they would provide at least a smart answer but instead, they still told me that they cannot do anything if i OVERSTAYED. Unbelievable, they once again tell me about overstaying while my message was not about that, the PCN was not about that and nothing was about that. 

At this point, I believe this is not about if they can do anything or not but if they can just properly read emails...

Anyway, I'm sending the MET appeal , although rejection is expected on that one and hopefully will get a better outcome from POPLA.

Whilst this is disappointing, I would write back to the CEO, and CC in the customer service person. 

Point out that the customer service person has not addressed any part of your e-mail/letter.  List out each part again in bullet points. Explain to the CEO that the reason you wrote to him, was precisely that Customer Service would just trot out a template letter, and not read the letter at all. 

Requote back the customer charter and founding principles to him, ask him how leaving a customer with a £100 to £170 charge, and a potential court case, aligns with any of them.

At the same time go onto all forms of  McDonalds social media and post about your issue. "£8.00 burger results in £100 parking charge, and threats of court action. McDonalds wont help out at all." - Just keep it all factual. When they remove your posts, then re post them.