Plumber Issues

Habib2342

Hi,

I recently contracted the services of a plumber to fix my water tank as it began to leak and the stopcocks became very difficult to operate. I don't know what I was thinking but I'd paid him all the money upfront( labour & materials). I had used this specific plumber before on past jobs and although some may view his charges as possibly OTT, he eventually got the jobs done to a decent standard.

Recently I had 3 major jobs that needed doing. The fist was the installation of a toilet. He'd arranged to come on a sunday afternoon and sent repeated messages to confirm he was coming  However he did not come after 2 hrs and my repeated calls.  I had paid him the cost of the toilet upfront, confident he'd come on time based on his track record. For reasons best to known to him, he decided not to come on that day. He left his address on one of his invoices so I went to his home to find out what was going on. He wasn't there so I left a msg with his housemate. Eventually he found out and was miffed I came to his house but told him he missed a job that we'd agreed for him to perform. I thought it was a one off and overlooked it .

He eventually did come after a few days and installed the toilet. He'd also came on time to do another job a few days later and that went smoothly. At this stage he pointed out the water tank leak and said it should be fixed urgently to avoid possible flooding. I took onboard his comments and left it for a week . 

Then I got a message saying he'd just come off a job where someone else had the same water tank issue and it caused flooding . I paid him the full job cost upfront in 3 amounts. He was supposed to come on Sunday but again did not come through due to not being able to source all the relevant parts. I've spent the past 3 days waiting for him to come through. Then yesterday evening he called me to say his supplier can't find the part and has requested a refund which will take up to 7 days to come through. 

I am on the fence as to whether he's being honest or is playing me. He could be honest because of his past track record although recent behaviour indicates something is up with him. Either way, if he's not able to do the job, he shouldn't take it and get the money upfront. 

I've spoken with my bank, told them everything and they advised me to wait until next Weds for the refund to materialize before escalating matters further.  I think there's a 50/50 chance the refund will come through. 

As you can see its a lot of hassle and chasing around of this guy I had to do that I should not be doing. I've found another plumber who came, quoted me on the job and he'll have everything finished by tomorrow. Its more expensive but its definitely worth it and I wish I'd gone with him in the first place. 

In the event the refund doesn't materialize, what are my next steps ? My bank is ready to escalate but only after 7 days have passed. Do I have to file something in Small claims , report to trading standards or action fraud. ?

Thanks.

DE_612183

If you paid by debit card you can request the bank do a chargeback - but I think you have to tell the plumber you want a refund and then wait 14 days ( which by next Wednesday that may be the case ).

Once the chargeback has happened the plumber has the option to challenge it, in which case you could have to do a Money Claim On-Line to get your money ( bit like small claims ).

Doubt it will go that far though - but if it does come back here and people will help you out.

Trading standards / Action Fraud won't be required.

Habib2342

well he has to wait for his supplier to refund the money which will take up to 7 days from y'day . i have told the plumber i want a refund and based on how he sounds on the phone, he seems he will fufiil this. However his recent behaviour may indicate he might not come through. He's made promises before and has not come through. 

He also mentioned he's not going to refund the full amount as he wants to keep some back for the materials he's already bought . So presumably he'll refund me for the labour that never happened. Is  he right by saying this?

 I don't really want to waste time and energy getting into further disputes with him, i've already wasted enough time already so Id' rather get a fair amount back instead of the full amount and move on and put it down to lesson learnt -past performance is not always a guarantee of future performance and all that...

born_again

He can refund you while he waits for the refund from the supplier.
Although it sounds more like a excuse than anything else.

Habib2342

thats what i thought...anyway just have to sit tight and hope he comes through...

Habib2342

'He also mentioned he's not going to refund the full amount as he wants to keep some back for the materials he's already bought . So presumably he'll refund me for the labour that never happened. Is  he right by saying this?'

Can someone advise if the plumber is right by taking this stance ?

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Habib2342 said:

'He also mentioned he's not going to refund the full amount as he wants to keep some back for the materials he's already bought . So presumably he'll refund me for the labour that never happened. Is  he right by saying this?'

Can someone advise if the plumber is right by taking this stance ?

Generally no.

However you mention you paid in 3 separate amounts, any reason why OP?

Habib2342

The first payment was for materials, and he offered for the balance to be paid after completion. However, the replacement water tank was more expensive than he thought, so i send a 2nd payment. The final payment was for additional pipework that he didn't plan for.

It was all a mess tbh. His invoices are not costed correctly. I thought one blip after having several jobs being completed successfully,  I'd let it slide. when it happened again, I couldn't believe how trusting and stupid I've been.  It should not take so much effort to successfully deal with trades people. Felt my stress levels go up.  At most I should have paid half upfront or just for materials only. 

I'm holding off calling him until next Weds. Hopefully I'll get a refund by then. Going forward, will seek out reliable and trustworthy people for any property work. 

Habib2342

If he can provide receipts for the materials he claims to have purchased before I told him the job is cancelled , then refunding labour only is ok ? If he can't then he should refund the full amount.

Alderbank

Habib2342 said:

If he can provide receipts for the materials he claims to have purchased before I told him the job is cancelled , then refunding labour only is ok ? If he can't then he should refund the full amount.

It sounds like you have two contracts; one for goods and one for services.

His purchase receipts don't matter. When you buy a tin of beans from the supermarket do you ask to see their receipt with the wholesaler?
If you agreed with him that he would supply you with specific items and he has done so then he has fulfilled his side of the sales contract. If he hasn't supplied the goods as or when agreed then he has breached the contract and you are entitled to a refund.

saajan_12

Habib2342 said:

If he can provide receipts for the materials he claims to have purchased before I told him the job is cancelled , then refunding labour only is ok ? If he can't then he should refund the full amount.

Then those materials would be yours - will he drop them off?