John Lewis caused a leak and damage to my home

MyRealNameToo

mikb said:

GDB2222 said:

It’s pretty likely that the installer reused an old pipe because he didn’t have a new one that was long enough. 

I wonder if all this damage is the reason why there was a caution in the manual for my machine, which said "Use the hoses we have provided, do NOT re-use your existing pipes". 

Maybe they know that there is a possible reliability/compatibility problem between older/other manufacturer's connectors. 

Or simply, the older ones get worn out from being under compression for years, and at the minimum would need new seals putting on them?

The rubber washer can certainly perish over time, it can also fall out and not be noticed when removed from one machine and put on another. 

Modern machine's supply pipe often also include an automatic shut off so if the weaker inner pipe goes the water supply is automatically shut off such that if the outer pipe subsequently goes you dont flood your house. They probably want to encourage use of this -v- the traditional straight pipe that has no features. 

Alderbank

Apologies if I've missed it in all the noise in this thread about red pipes and blue pipes but what has your household insurer said about your kitchen floor damage?

The usual advice on this forum is to claim for accidental property damage on your household insurance. After all, that's what you pay them for. If they think it is worthwhile to claim against a third party they will take care of that, probably with more success.

Boohoo

Alderbank said:

Apologies if I've missed it in all the noise in this thread about red pipes and blue pipes but what has your household insurer said about your kitchen floor damage?

The usual advice on this forum is to claim for accidental property damage on your household insurance. After all, that's what you pay them for. If they think it is worthwhile to claim against a third party they will take care of that, probably with more success.

That's if the OP has accidentall cover with their insurance company.

If they do it would depend on the excess amount as some can be hundreds of pounds.

My opinion is that the damage to the floor looks historic but hard to see from the dark photos posted 

That been said if the WM installation was faulty then that would not help the situation.

cmthephoenix

To go at a slightly different tangent. Is your washing machine water supply and waste pipes (ie. the thing the red hose attaches to on the wall) within 1 metre of your washing machine location. If not then I think the original installation of the washing machine should have been aborted (with potential charges) and maybe what the original discussion between the installers was about with 1 saying they should refuse and the other saying just to reuse the old hose connection.  John Lewis are clear (at least now, don't know about at the original install time) that it is the customer's responsibility to check that the wster supply and waste outlets are within 1 metre of the washing machine location.
 John Lewis & Partners | Homeware, Fashion, Electricals & More

Alderbank

That's interesting ^^.

Those T&Cs say that it is the consumer's responsibility to provide water and electricity supply points within 1 metre of the appliance. They say 'The electricity supply must be a standard socket outlet, and not an extension lead' but there is no similar qualification for the water supply. They say if the purchaser has any concerns about the water supply to speak with a qualified plumber about the work required before booking an installation service.

JLP don't claim their delivery partners, who will carry out the installation service if requested, are qualified plumbers. They hold them out as competent to carry out the user installation instructions given by the manufacturer.

There is no reason to doubt the delivery guys when they say they don't carry red hoses. In every case they will simply use the 1.5m cold (blue) hose supplied as standard with modern machines, as the instructions tell them to do. The most likely explanation for the red hose is that it was part of the installation of the previous washing machine.

I think they have taken the consumer's water supply point to be the brass BSP 3/4" to 22mm compression coupler screwed into the red flexible hose. It isn't best practice to daisy-chain flexible hoses but it is neither illegal nor necessarily unsafe and has been presented as suitable by the consumer.

I think that proving negligence by the delivery partners or vicariously by JLP might be difficult.

MyRealNameToo

Alderbank said:

Apologies if I've missed it in all the noise in this thread about red pipes and blue pipes but what has your household insurer said about your kitchen floor damage?

The usual advice on this forum is to claim for accidental property damage on your household insurance. After all, that's what you pay them for. If they think it is worthwhile to claim against a third party they will take care of that, probably with more success.

The problem is the OP is alleging defective workmanship which is a standard exclusion from Home Insurance

cmthephoenix

Alderbank said:

I think that proving negligence by the delivery partners or vicariously by JLP might be difficult.

I could very much imagine a situation whereby JL installers came to site, saw they couldn't fit their new supplied hoses to the wall connections and have the washing machine in the place required (in the same way presumably the old washing machine hadn't been either) and one installer wanted to just leave site and say to the customer you need to get everything within 1 metre of the washing machine as per ts and cs, and the other wanted to do the customer 'a favour' and reuse the old flexihoses. Hence the muttering and "clear something was wrong".

steviebuk

Long shot but see if the local press are interested. JLP won't like the bad press so may then claim "They will fix as a good will gesture". The installer won't admit fault as no doubt he's probably done it at multiple sites which they'd have to pay for.