Santander free forever bank account changes

flickadee001

So it looks like this is still going ahead for the end of this month?
Have just joined Monzo, in lieu of this happening.

Seems a straight forward account open with debit card, Apple Pay etc.

My only gripe is that i have to notify all my DD's, and payments as I don't believe the switching service works for Business Accounts?

I'll still wait a week or so, but I can't see Santander backing down now?

Section62

MeteredOut said:

Section62 said:

MeteredOut said:

I simply cannot foresee a world where the FOS or the FCA will (or even can) force a bank to keep an account fee-free forever, even if they do agree that's what was promised.
...

Why not?

If the promise was free for 5 years, and the bank then started charging after 3, do you think the regulator would say that was fair?

Or if the promise was to pay a fixed rate of interest on a savings acount for 10 years, then stopped paying after 8?

If there is some kind of line drawn where a promise no longer needs to be kept, then what is the legal basis for that line?

I'm not saying they'll say its not fair, but I simply cannot see a regulator imposing something for perpetuity. I think they'll find a way to allow Santander to do what they want with within the framework they operate, but probably something customers will see as no more than a slap on the wrist.

And, perversely, yes, I do think that if the promise was for 10 years (or even 20) and stopped after 8 (or even 2), the it is more likely that they'd enforce it to completion.

Let's see if I'm right or wrong. If wrong, I'll openly admit it. Opinions can be wrong.

I was more interested in the wider implications of this.  AFAIK Santander's free forever promise is more or less unique in current account services, but in wider financial services there are products which involve long-term promises.  An example I thought of was for life annuities.  What is the point of having a 'guaranteed income for life' if the provider could decide to stop it after (say) 10 years and the regulator wouldn't (or couldn't) do anything about it?  Hence the question - is there a legal basis for drawing a line when it comes to timescales?

If we were talking about some kind of existential threat to the provider, with other customers seriously affected if one group continued to be protected, then I could see some justification for the regulator deciding that the 'forever' promise had to come to an end in the wider interest (and that the 'free forever' group would lose that anyway if the company went bust).

But some of those who might be termed 'the opposition' in this thread have been at pains to point out how trivial this group of customers is in the scheme of things, or have highlighted Santander's profits, or significantly increased share price.  Therefore it seems perhaps unlikely that the FCA could use Santander's dire circumstances as justification for agreeing that 'forever' doesn't really mean 'forever'.

So if the regulator and FoS both decided that long-term promises really aren't worth the paper, then what implications does that have for everybody else?

Futuristic

flickadee001 said:

So it looks like this is still going ahead for the end of this month?
Have just joined Monzo, in lieu of this happening.

Seems a straight forward account open with debit card, Apple Pay etc.

My only gripe is that i have to notify all my DD's, and payments as I don't believe the switching service works for Business Accounts?

I'll still wait a week or so, but I can't see Santander backing down now?

There is switching for business. But if you made a complaint to FOS you should not switch and take the risk of couple of monthly payments to Santander and operate accounts separately.

https://monzo.com/business-banking/business-switch

solidpro

clairec666 said:

The problem is that Santander might have dodged the "forever" promise with their 2015 changes, and any legal ruling may rest on whether they adequately informed customers on the implications of those changes.

Spoiler alert: they didn't.

clairec666

solidpro said:

clairec666 said:

The problem is that Santander might have dodged the "forever" promise with their 2015 changes, and any legal ruling may rest on whether they adequately informed customers on the implications of those changes.

Spoiler alert: they didn't.

I'm in agreement, but I'm no legal expert

Smurrfmo

clairec666 said:

Totally agree - this is an unusual case because I've never seen anything else offering "free forever" and it's a bit of a strange thing for Abbey to have offered without some legal small print that allowed them to wiggle out of it after 10 years or something. So "forever" surely must be taken to mean the literal English meaning of the word.

There were caveats to the free forever promise involving changes to banking, regulatory or tax laws.  Santander has chosen not to use any such caveats in this case and it is doubtful whether they could ever be used.

amyfairweather

@Section62, they’ve also just re-signed Ant and Dec for their adverts so clearly are not short of a bob or £9.99

MeteredOut

amyfairweather said:

@Section62, they’ve also just re-signed Ant and Dec for their adverts so clearly are not short of a bob or £9.99

I wonder if their contract with Ant & Dec has an defined end date clause.

gt94sss2

huw01 said:

gt94sss2 said:

mcouriers said:

I'm a sole trader & I was thinking of opening a Santander everyday personal current account & closing my business account or opening an account with mettle. I've got a NatWest personal account for things that are not related to m work. Would the Santander Everyday personal account be ok?

I would not use a personal account for running a business. It will almost certainly be against the t&c of the account.

There are several banks which do not charge any monthly fees for small business accounts such as HSBC and Mettle.

How likely is this to happen ?

 I've operated a standalone personal current account with another bank which I use to have my income used for self assessment returns for some time.

What would trigger the bank to say hang on this geezer is using it as a business account. Looking at any monthly statement it just looks like I have a few part time jobs.

I don't work for a bank but I assume it would largely be account conduct.

Having said that, with some banks now offering free business accounts plus the ever increasing rules/regulations about knowing your customer, confirmation of payee and anti money laundering, why risk having your account closed at short notice for breaching the T&C?

eskbanker

Smurrfmo said:

clairec666 said:

Totally agree - this is an unusual case because I've never seen anything else offering "free forever" and it's a bit of a strange thing for Abbey to have offered without some legal small print that allowed them to wiggle out of it after 10 years or something. So "forever" surely must be taken to mean the literal English meaning of the word.

There were caveats to the free forever promise involving changes to banking, regulatory or tax laws.  Santander has chosen not to use any such caveats in this case and it is doubtful whether they could ever be used.

I think it was mentioned earlier in the thread that their use of the phrase "the business banking landscape has evolved significantly over the last decade" was likely to have been carefully crafted to leave room for development if/when the discussion moves onto a more formal footing.

Having said that, I don't think those caveats were actually present throughout the entire history of the 'free forever' promise anyway....