Smart meters rocketing prices

Aartee

My economy7 electricity meter has been replaced with a smart meter because the RTS signal that controlled the original meter was being switched off.
I was assured I would see no change to how the supply operated, just have the advantage of no longer needing to manually take readings.  This has been far removed from the truth. The meter was initially set to record all use at one rate only. It was then changed and set to read "transposed" and recorded peak rate use at off-peak times and vice versa.  It was then altered again to its current settings, which I will explain later.
During the 5 months since the meter was changed I have had numerous contacts with the supplier EDF, during most of which they have been far more focused on denying there is a problem than listening to, or answering points I had raised.

The supply to the property is split into two separate fuse panels.  One is powered 24 hours a day for normal use and the other controlled by the meter to supply Night storage heaters and off-peak water heating.  This off-peak fuse panel is only powered for 7 hours a day, hence the term economy7.  All of the power used by the off-peak load was previously charged at the off-peak rate, but this is no longer true on my account.
Yesterday EDF finally confirmed that 2 hours of my 'off-peak' supply is now charged at peak rate.
For years now in this area, the economy7 operating times has been split into 2 periods totaling 7 hours,  22.30 to 00.30 and 02.30 to 07.30.  EDF now state only power used from 00.30 to 07.30 are counted at off-peak rates.
As anyone familiar with using storage heating will know, the majority of consumption is at the start of the nights charging period when both water and heater temperatures are at there lowest.  This means the majority of my consumption is in the first 2 hour period where it now charges at peak rate prices.
  
The original meter was mechanically linked to switch and count power used by the off-peak load at the same time.
Smart meters can clearly be remotely operated to switch when it charges off-peak rates independently from when it switches the off-peak load.  This makes a mockery of the term 'economy7'.

I wonder how many other customers have been effected by this problem since their smart meter was fitted.  

sheenas

I have seen quite a few posts around this exact issue. I would look at a new timer or resetting the timer to come on much later. The heaters needs a good 7 hours to fully heat up, while the water maybe 30-60mins depending on how much water you need.

Scot_39

Remote dynamic switching - not normally how standard E7 works - which just works off of parameterized tables of times downloaded to the meter after install - but possibly after price updates maybe too(*) - for iirc in that case the tariff timings.

Although smart meters can be switched remotely - the only tariff that may be doing that right now AFAIK - and it's only a may - as they are kind of scant on the details - is perhaps Snug Octopus - as it has far more variability if users choose fewer over night hours or supplier gives away more overnight hours (which they have done by switching on heaters 1->2 hours before the tariffs 0030 to 0630 overnight off peak core - as well as the 1 hr afternoon in some posts here)

In a vanilla E7 - using the meters in built timing control - a feature referred to as ALCS - Auxiliary Load Control Switch to control the heaters - the meters should be set with two independent tables matching - the one for tariff timing and the ALCS calander timing (to switch on the restricted feed for 7 hours on E7) matched.

So if your E7 was programmed as old - the heating would be switched on for 2 off for 2 and on for 5 as required.

And if programmed for single block - as new - the heating should only be switched on for the 7 - starting at the appropriate time.

There should therefore be no overcharging for 2 hours regardless IF meter set-up properly.

(*) But as per Apr 1st problem for @Rosie1001 thread - these 2 tables got out of sync on her meter.  But again EDF once they got clear evidence - fairly quickly responded - with an impressive - as took fair bit of effort by the user it has to be said to gather it - and fixed - days / weeks not months.

If however your heating is self timed from the 24/7 output - sounds unlikely given you have a twin consumer unit - and I assume a 5 port (or 4 port with auxiliary contactor) time restricted feed from meter cabinet driving it - you should not be being charged the wrong rates - because you set set the devices to match youre exact meter times (including any surge offset preset on those timings which can in theory IIRC by upto a 30 min delay on smart meters - so although your regional default might be 00:30 - some might switch 00:35 or 00:40 etc).

Arguably perhaps nagging them to get your 2+2+5 back - if you did (and others have and gotten it back) might have caused the two to go out of sync - with them not updating the ALCS calendar to match.

And it is sadly - more than possible - that the existence of both tables in a standard multirate (largely E7 these days) smart meter - might not even be common knowledge even amongst standard customer support tariff - but only their more dedicated metering teams. 

But regardless of how or when it happened - if reliant on meter ALCS control - and your tariff times and ALCS calendar do not match - then you need to get EDF to reconfigure the meter - as only the authorized supplier of the meter can do that.

QrizB

Aartee said:

Yesterday EDF finally confirmed that 2 hours of my 'off-peak' supply is now charged at peak rate.

Your off-peak supply period is when your meter is recording usage on the off-peak register. No more, no less.

Aartee said:

For years now in this area, the economy7 operating times has been split into 2 periods totaling 7 hours,  22.30 to 00.30 and 02.30 to 07.30.  EDF now state only power used from 00.30 to 07.30 are counted at off-peak rates. ...  This means the majority of my consumption is in the first 2 hour period where it now charges at peak rate prices.

Your storage heaters should only be charging when the meter is recording at the off-peak rates. If that period is now 0030-0730, that's when your heaters should be charging. What makes you think that they aren't?

Aartee said:

The original meter was mechanically linked to switch and count power used by the off-peak load at the same time.

Your new meter should also be wired like this, by use of either a 5-terminal meter (with the E7 circuits powered via the fifth terminal) or a 4-terminal meter with an external contactor (and the E7 circuits powered via the contactor). Do you have one of these arrangements?

Aartee

Thanks for the comments Scot_39.

The actual switching times controlled by the meter to the dedicated separate economy7 supply are from 22.33 to 00.33 and 02.33 to 07.33.  This has remained the same as the old meter it replaced.  I have repeatedly checked and found this to be consistent.  There are neon indicators on some off-peak loads.  Yesterday EDF stated off-peak rate charge times were from 00.20 to 07.30.

I have repeatedly informed EDF of this fact and got nowhere.  A long period of emails to EDF finally ended with them cutting off replies after their last contact promised I would be receiving a report that has still never arrived.

After this I contacted the ombudsman who took details of my complaint and gave EDF a deadline for a reply.  After the deadline passed I received an email from EDF saying they would follow upon my complaints.  Culminating in finally confirming that my charging period is different from off-peak supply times.  I had been repeatedly asking if this was the case and still await any offer to rectify it.

Currently my bill is still hugely inflated as day rates are now charged for the majority of my smart meter controlled off-peak usage.

So far EDF in emails have totally failed to consider this is a problem, let alone offer to rectify it.

Confidence in the reliability of smart meters or the ability of staff to calibrate them is at an all time low.  Especially after the recorded reading actually went backwards between two consecutive bills.
From my experience the new meters can be remotely altered to say whatever they want and alter off-peak supply and charging periods at different times as they see fit.
At least you could rely on the old meters to be mechanically locked to change both functions at the same time.

masonic

I don't think this is the meter's fault. EDF should set it up to match the off-peak times it is offering you. It sounds like that's 00:30-07:30 BST. Ombudsman ought to decide that your usage between 22:30-00:30 while programmed incorrectly should be charged as off-peak. The good thing about a smart meter is that each half hour's consumption is captured and can be used to determine how much you are out of pocket.

Aartee

Thanks masonic.
Hub graphics on energy usage clearly show the expected 1/2hourly use with biggest peak from 22.30 to 23.00.
Adding consumptions over 24 hours for times supplied by off-peak meter are clearly far more than totals of all other periods.  Smart meter readings for same period show far higher peak usage.  All these details have repeatedly reported to EDF by email.

I am in agreement with other comments on the forum and pleased to hear that it is a problem previously encountered and sounding easy and quick to rectify.  Unfortunately it is down to EDF to rectify the problem and after months of trying I have so far failed to get any of their staff to spend the time to listen to the complaint and do anything about rectifying it.
It is frustrating that a problem so seemingly easy to rectify has been ignored so long, it needed to have to resort to the ombudsman.

Hopefully these problems that started in December last year will eventually get sorted.

Scot_39

Read this post with a suggested response from @Ildhund in the Rosie1001 thread - you could modify with your split time E7 in place of E10 vs E7 if you want and forward to the relevent complaint / ombudsman if still open - the correct terms might just trigger the mind of a switched on staffer and prompt the correction required.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/81382782/#Comment_81382782

Your in a fairly similar situation - except it wasnt an April update but since Dec meter switch, if I uunderstand it correctly your ALCS times are split E7 - 2+2+5 as your original install (hers were E10 as prior to Apr ) - but your tariff times are single block E7 (hers were also single block E7 not E10).

E7 split is a perfectly reasonable demand - it was one suppliers standard in 1 if not 2 regions at one stage.

So could edit out the bit about April, change the E10 to "split E7" 2 off peak (22:30-00:30) + 5 off peak (02:30->07:30) timings desired - the E7 maybe to single block E7 (00:30 - 07:30) as appropriate.

Assuming you prefer the split - ask them to fix the tariff timing as in that example - as Rose1001 wanted E10 timings.

But the bottom line is the two tables must match - and until they do - you billing will be wrong.

And as well as fixing now - hopefully they do update their records to a matched configuration - so don't unfix in future.  

But if I were you - perhaps a pessimistic take on supplier's level of competence - I'd probably check again come Jul, Oct if / after get any future price updates just in case.

Aartee

Thanks again Scot_39.

I have repeatedly tried telling EDF that I have no problem when the economy7 actually supplies the off-peak load and only asked for conformation this is charged off-peak rates at the same time.

Perhaps you can now see why I feel so frustrated.

WiserMiser

Send the EDF CEO a Letter Before Action stating that you will make a court claim against them.  That should wake them up a bit.

Lesser_spotted_Catshark

Aartee said:

My economy7 electricity meter has been replaced with a smart meter because the RTS signal that controlled the original meter was being switched off.
I was assured I would see no change to how the supply operated, just have the advantage of no longer needing to manually take readings.  This has been far removed from the truth. 

I have a similar problem, I recently changed to a fixed rate with Outfox Energy and allowed them to fit a smart meter. The problem I have is that the meter's 5th terminal is switching the water and storage on at 01:08 but the meter doesn't go over to night rate until 01:35. I've spoken to Outfox and they appear to acknowledge that this would be a problem and have passed it over to their meter team to look at re-programming the meter. I'm not hopeful of a swift resolution.