Can I sue my finacial advisor, and or company

Bbeanie

If I was offering a service and I failed.  Would'nt I have the pants sued off me? Regardless of whether they had profitied incidently.

Doesn't this mean the company are a waste of space but are not peanalised in any way? Wow!

masonic

Bbeanie said:

If I was offering a service and I failed.  Would'nt I have the pants sued off me? Regardless of whether I had profitied incidently.

Anyone can sue anyone else for anything. But winning takes a lot more than that.

The situation you describe is of services being made available for a fee. Where you availed yourself of those services, there were failings for which you've been offered redress based on the standard of "fair treatment". Whereas to sue you would need to establish "breach of contract". So what does the contract actually guarantee in return for the fees? Because typically an adviser is there to provide advice when needed, which can involve wildly different levels of engagement over different periods of time or for different clients.

If you set up an online horoscope service that people could subscribe to for on demand predictions for the day ahead, and at times failed to provide them in a timely manner, I think most likely you'd just lose repeat business. Those customers that continued to pay, but didn't end up needing the service, would be very unlikely to successfully sue for a refund.

dunstonh

Basically, both of these complaints ended up with the Ombudsman, treated as one case, it has taken forever and now they have come back saying I have suffered no monetary loss and offered me £400 for stress and anxiety??

A complaint can be upheld and still result in no redress.    Often in that scenario, a higher inconvenience payment is offered and £400 is at the upper end (£250 is more commonplace).

I'm surprised the fee taken after servicing ended hasn't been refunded.  What did the FOS say on that point?

I am really unhappy abojut this and this it is grossly unfair and am now considering taking it to the small claims court.  Do you think I may have a case?

Whilst you have the right to do that, the courts will consider the outcome of the FOS review as an independent arbiter of complaints.      

Three years of fees, kept by the service provider?  Why is that? 

Was it fees or was it commission?
Providers will usually retain commission that would be paid to the adviser if you remove the adviser.   Whereas if its a fee, the provider will not retain the fee.

I thought it was a one off but I have spoken to another FA through Pensionwise and they have told me that I have to pay this fee again to move my money into a new company??

Pensionwise do not have FAs.

 Surely this is incombent on them?

No.  Its like getting a decorator and then getting another decorator to do the work again as you don't like the first one.   The second one is not responsible for the other party.

No, I haven't escalated it to the Ombudsman yet, but I certainly intend to.  Won't the Ombudsman take the advice of  his investigator thougfh?

In simple cases, the ombudsman rarely overturns an investigator.  However, in complex cases, it is more possible.  The overturn rate is around 1 in 10.   Basically, if an investigator and an ombudsman ruling is against you then its pretty unlikely any court case would find in your favour.

If I was offering a service and I failed.  Would'nt I have the pants sued off me? Regardless of whether they had profitied incidently.

Yes.  However, the loss would need to be identified along with any potential gain.    

markets fell heavily over 24 feb to 24 March 2020.   They bounced back very quickly.    So, if they measured the unit price of the sale of units that would have been in that period vs the unit price you actually got, then its quite possible you have suffered no financial loss.    

Doesn't this mean the company are a waste of space but are not peanalised in any way? Wow!

You said you were awarded £400.  That is a penalty.

QrizB

Bbeanie said:

When I moved my pension from my works pension into a sipp with this company, I had to pay a fee of several thousands.

Was your old works pension a Defined Benefit (final salary / CARE) pension?

There are often significant fees associated with transferring those, larger than would be the case with a Defined Contribution (money purchase) pension.

Hoenir

Bbeanie said:

'Investments have generally risen since March 2020, so wouldn't you now be better off than you would have been?'

Why would this impact the case with the Ombudsman?  

You are claiming financial loss. The aim of damages is to accurately reflect the financial harm you have experienced without inflating the claim.

Aretnap

Bbeanie said:

If I was offering a service and I failed.  Would'nt I have the pants sued off me? Regardless of whether they had profitied incidently.

Doesn't this mean the company are a waste of space but are not peanalised in any way? Wow!

The purpose of compensation (whether awarded by the financial ombudsman or by the civil courts) is not to punish the company for being useless, it's to make good the losses that you personally have suffered as a result of their uselessness. Punitive damages are not really a thing in English law, not in situations like this anyway.

A company could make a completely inadvertent and out of character mistake which cost you tens of thousands of pounds - in which case you could claim tens of thousands of pounds from them in compensation.

Or they could be systematically negligent and useless from start to finish but by pure good fortune you did not suffer any financial loss as a result. In which case you would not be due any compensation, possibly beyond a small amount for intangible or non-financial losses like stress and inconvenience. It sounds like this is what the FOS has found.

So yes it's entirely possible for the company to be a waste of space but not to have to pay much, if any, compensation, to you personally at least. Suing a company because your angry with them, without being able to show exactly what their behavior has cost you, is a bit of a fools errand I'm afraid.

Bbeanie

Thank you all for your replies.  They are certainly food for thought.

masonic.  I thought I was paying for my account to be looked after and for my instructions to be followed, which they were not.

Thank you for your analogy of the horoscope service, which I found questionable.

dunstonh.  Thank you for your explanation.  I am glad it is at the upper end of the compensation?

I found the non refund on the three years fees particularly upsetting.  In March 2020, my FA failed to complete a withdrawal as per my instructions.  I complained to him via a text in March 2020, he did not reply.  He then failed to complete a withdrawal for April 2020 as per my instuctions given at the same review.  In May, I compained to  the company and asked for him to be removed from my account.  I was then surprised to receive a text from him in Feb 2021, asking if I wanted a review, followed up by a letter.  I considered these to be unsolicited and ignored them thinking he was trying to put himself back onto my account.  However, they are now saying he sent the same one paragraph letter in 2022 and 2023 but I have no recollection of these, nor are they in my paperwork.  Because of this the investigator has considered that I took the decision to ‘consciously’ decline the invitations for an annual review.  This, after the investigator had already said he found him to be disingenuous.  I am not convinced the  letters from 2022 and 2023 were ever sent or even why after I had effectively sacked him?  And then of course, the FA I was assigned in 2024 did exactly the same thing.

As far as I am aware, it was definitely a fee.

No Pensionwise do not have FAs but they do have a list of them and you fill in a form and they get one of them to contact you.  However, I was not happy with the lack of choice.  I assumed they would sent me the details of a few of them for me to contact.  I was very surprised to receive a telephone call from one of them.

Having failed me on more than one occasion, over two advisors, I felt I had been put into the position of having to remove my account.  Therefore I felt that they should be responsible for the cost.  Surely nobody could expect me to continue with their services?

Thank you for your further advice.

QrizB.  Yes it was which is why I am puzzled that I was told I would have to pay the full fees again, transferring to another provider.

Hoenir.  Thank you for your explanation.

Aretnap.  Great explanation, thank you.  And yes, the company was useless from beginning to end.  I am really surprised that any company dealing with peoples finances are allowed to behave this way and effectively get away with it.  £400 is not an accurate reflection of the stress, anxiety, time and effort this has cost me and is a mere raindrop into the ocean to them.  Even if they had been fined by the Ombudsman without it coming to me, it would feel better.  As it is, I feel they gave no service and respnsibility at all and got away with it.  I thought they were held to a higher standard, but obviously not.  In their place, dealing with millions, I would be laughing at £400 compensation.

Thank you all.

masonic

Bbeanie said:

masonic.  I thought I was paying for my account to be looked after and for my instructions to be followed, which they were not.

You were paying for your instructions to be followed and for ongoing advice as needed. There were failings in the former, which is why you received a D&I compensation award. However, the inaction appears to have left you in a better overall position than you would have been in had the failings not occurred, so the FOS has not awarded anything for financial loss.

Had you been able to provide evidence that you dissolved the contract with the advisory firm, the adjudicator would surely have decided in your favour about the refund of fees. The letter inviting you to take up an annual review is strong evidence the contract was not ended, and likely the adjudicator had sight of the letters for subsequent years. If you have evidence the contract was ended (such as an acknowledgement from their side) perhaps you could convince an ombudsman to revisit this point.

Bbeanie said:

Even if they had been fined by the Ombudsman without it coming to me, it would feel better.  As it is, I feel they gave no service and respnsibility at all and got away with it.  I thought they were held to a higher standard, but obviously not.  In their place, dealing with millions, I would be laughing at £400 compensation.

The FOS is not allowed to fine firms, but firms pay a case fee when customers use the service. The last time I checked that was £850.

Bbeanie

£850!  Feeling better.

Bbeanie

Just another question.  Why were his fees for 2020 not refunded when he so obviously failed to carry out my instructions?  £400 compensation while he gets to keep his fee even for that year is insulting?  He must be laughing too.  I assume he keeps his fees on the same basis, that I hadn't suffered the loss.  When I worked for companies, if I didn't carry out my work duties, I would have been sacked.  Guess things have changed.