Buying a fake at auction

lollyaddy

Hello, newbie here,
I’ve been a muppet and got carried away looking for a 50th birthday present and bought a sketch believing it to be by a well known 20th century painter. I’ve won it at auction but not paid for it yet. I asked for the provenance or proof of authenticity but apparently it doesn’t have any, only a story from the auction house about the seller buying it from them a few years ago and deciding to resell it again. 

I’ve been in touch with the painters foundation who I think are the painters family and who offer to help with these questions and they say that they can’t be sure but it doesn’t look bonafide. 

So the question is, what are my options? Do I have to collect and pay for it or am I in a position to refuse without proof that it’s authentic?

Thanks in advance

DullGreyGuy

lollyaddy said:

Hello, newbie here,
I’ve been a muppet and got carried away looking for a 50th birthday present and bought a sketch believing it to be by a well known 20th century painter. I’ve won it at auction but not paid for it yet. I asked for the provenance or proof of authenticity but apparently it doesn’t have any, only a story from the auction house about the seller buying it from them a few years ago and deciding to resell it again. 

I’ve been in touch with the painters foundation who I think are the painters family and who offer to help with these questions and they say that they can’t be sure but it doesn’t look bonafide. 

So the question is, what are my options? Do I have to collect and pay for it or am I in a position to refuse without proof that it’s authentic?

Thanks in advance

So presumably this was an auction house, not eBay, and you did have the opportunity to go view the lot before bidding on it irrespective of if you did actually go there to look at it?

soolin

lollyaddy said:

Hello, newbie here,
I’ve been a muppet and got carried away looking for a 50th birthday present and bought a sketch believing it to be by a well known 20th century painter. I’ve won it at auction but not paid for it yet. I asked for the provenance or proof of authenticity but apparently it doesn’t have any, only a story from the auction house about the seller buying it from them a few years ago and deciding to resell it again. 

I’ve been in touch with the painters foundation who I think are the painters family and who offer to help with these questions and they say that they can’t be sure but it doesn’t look bonafide. 

So the question is, what are my options? Do I have to collect and pay for it or am I in a position to refuse without proof that it’s authentic?

Thanks in advance

Was this a bricks and mortar auction house and did you view the item? Did the listing state it was genuine or just ‘believed’ to be genuine? 

comeandgo

What description was given for the sketching?  I’d find it very unusual for an auction house to definitively say it’s a genuine.

soolin

comeandgo said:

What description was given for the sketching?  I’d find it very unusual for an auction house to definitively say it’s a genuine.

I use auction houses, not the posh ones, just the local ones. usually if they have no provenance they say something like 'signed A Titchmarsh' rather than signed by A Titchmarsh, those statements mean completely different things. 

I am hoping OP comes back to clarify, but a basic reading suggests this was sold without provenance or a guarantee as buyer asked about both only after winning the auction. 

ButterCheese

The Auction House have basically said "sold as seen" - it's up to you to determine beforehand if it's genuine or not, and based on that, what price you are willing to pay.  You'll have to check with the auction house and see what their T&Cs state; I suspect that if you win the bid then you have to pay.  They won't tell you what will happen if you don't pay, but if they have any of your details then they may well be able to chase you for the money.  

lollyaddy

Thanks for comments so far. 

So yes it was an auction house not eBay and I place bids live but online. The auction house is in Wales and I’m in the north east so going to view it wasn’t really an option. 

The description is … Pencil sketch ‘The Artist’ ‘Title’ tsigned ‘artist’ and then followed with dates of his lifetime. 

There’s no mention of provenance or whether it’s an original work but it does say by

I realise I have made a bit of a blunder 

lollyaddy

I have said to the auction house that I assumed it would have provenance as they were selling it as by the artist and would like time to look into this. So will wait to hear their reply. 

It may in fact be authentic but… then again it might not. I just feel the auction house should have a duty to be honest on behalf of the seller as most people buy in good faith expecting the description to be genuine. 

RFW

ButterCheese said:

The Auction House have basically said "sold as seen" - it's up to you to determine beforehand if it's genuine or not, and based on that, what price you are willing to pay.  You'll have to check with the auction house and see what their T&Cs state;

The T&Cs don't trump the law. Most auction terms and conditions would allow them to get out of it.

This really depends on how the item was described. If the auction house is passing something fake off as genuine that's against the law no matter what their terms say. If they described it vaguely without mentioning the artist then the OP will likely have inferred a lot and then it could go either way. If they went with "Painting in the style of Joe Bloggs" or variations thereof then they have likely done nothing wrong. Price will be a factor too, irrespective of the auction. If the OP has paid a tenner for a Lowry then they have no right to think it's genuine, if they've paid £10 million then they should expect it to be genuine. I'm guessing it falls somewhere in the middle of that range!

For the OP if you aren't happy with the auction house you can contact Trading Standards via your local council (it doesn't matter if that's the auction's council or not). They will advise what your rights are and what you can do next, if anything.