Potential shower room leak, advice please.

bpk101

I have a loft shower room situated directly above our children's bedroom and a few months ago the shower got clogged with hair and sprang a leak which slowly resulted in damp stains appearing on the ceiling of the bedroom below.

The clog has been sorted and water is running freely (although we daren't use the shower at the minute) and I now want to fix the ceiling stains in the bedroom. A few questions if anyone with plumbing experience is able to advise...

1. How can I be sure there's no joints or seals broken in the shower room piping and that the stains won't simply reappear? 

2. Is it a guarantee that because of the stains the pipe work or seals between things have burst?

3. If the pipework needs to be checked and repaired how do we access it all for inspection? The shower tray and pipework is tiled in and the room tanked. Would we need to open up the ceiling below and inspect from here, or is this not possible?

Looking at the pics, damp stain 2 is directly beneath the wet room shower tray, stain 1 is beneath the sink. I'm a bit worried about the leak continuing as stain 1 is quite close to the light fixture in the bedroom.

Thanks.

CliveOfIndia

bpk101 said:

I have a loft shower room situated directly above our children's bedroom and a few months ago the shower got clogged with hair and sprang a leak which slowly resulted in damp stains appearing on the ceiling of the bedroom below.  A clogged plughole wouldn't normally lead directly to a leak.  It's possible that the plughole isn't sealed correctly into the shower floor - so as the water level rises, it was leaking around the top of the plughole, if you see what I mean.

The clog has been sorted and water is running freely (although we daren't use the shower at the minute) and I now want to fix the ceiling stains in the bedroom. A few questions if anyone with plumbing experience is able to advise...

1. How can I be sure there's no joints or seals broken in the shower room piping and that the stains won't simply reappear? You can't be sure.  But it's more likely that either the sealant around the floor/wall panels or some of the tile grouting has got cracked/split, which is pretty easy to rectify.

2. Is it a guarantee that because of the stains the pipe work or seals between things have burst?  No - as above, cracked sealant is a more common scenario.

3. If the pipework needs to be checked and repaired how do we access it all for inspection? The shower tray and pipework is tiled in and the room tanked. Would we need to open up the ceiling below and inspect from here, or is this not possible?  If you do need to get to the pipework, it's a bit of a bu&&er to be honest, there's no easy way to do it.  You either have to remove some tiles/wall panels, or access from underneath, as you say.  Either option would entail a fair amount of upheaval.

Looking at the pics, damp stain 2 is directly beneath the wet room shower tray, stain 1 is beneath the sink. I'm a bit worried about the leak continuing as stain 1 is quite close to the light fixture in the bedroom.  Very often the stain doesn't really indicate where the leak is.  If it's a slow leak (rather than a flood), then water will very often drip along the joists, and emerge quite a way from where the actual leak is.

Thanks.

Some comments in bold above.  Not sure if they help at all, but hopefully they may give you some pointers.

Exodi

Firstly, I wouldn't bother painting the ceiling until you can confirm the issue.

I doubt it'll disappear because you unclogged the drain but you can't verify either way if you're not using the shower and you don't want to inspect the plumbing.

A clogged pipe doesn't cause it to leak. As above, I agree you should check and re-apply sealant to ensure it's not leaking round the edges of the shower tray (had that before) or plugholes (also had that before!).

Where there is bad access in the bathroom, it's not necessarily the end of the world to open up the ceiling to inspect the pipework, I've done it (and located and fixed a leak on two occasions - as you can probably tell I had a lot of leaks when I first moved into the house, in one day we fixed 5 separate leaks!).

I'd check the sealant, carry on having showers to see if the issue gets worse, if it does probably cut some holes in the ceiling and see if you can locate the issue.

bpk101

CliveOfIndia said:

bpk101 said:

I have a loft shower room situated directly above our children's bedroom and a few months ago the shower got clogged with hair and sprang a leak which slowly resulted in damp stains appearing on the ceiling of the bedroom below.  A clogged plughole wouldn't normally lead directly to a leak.  It's possible that the plughole isn't sealed correctly into the shower floor - so as the water level rises, it was leaking around the top of the plughole, if you see what I mean.

The clog has been sorted and water is running freely (although we daren't use the shower at the minute) and I now want to fix the ceiling stains in the bedroom. A few questions if anyone with plumbing experience is able to advise...

1. How can I be sure there's no joints or seals broken in the shower room piping and that the stains won't simply reappear? You can't be sure.  But it's more likely that either the sealant around the floor/wall panels or some of the tile grouting has got cracked/split, which is pretty easy to rectify.

2. Is it a guarantee that because of the stains the pipe work or seals between things have burst?  No - as above, cracked sealant is a more common scenario.

3. If the pipework needs to be checked and repaired how do we access it all for inspection? The shower tray and pipework is tiled in and the room tanked. Would we need to open up the ceiling below and inspect from here, or is this not possible?  If you do need to get to the pipework, it's a bit of a bu&&er to be honest, there's no easy way to do it.  You either have to remove some tiles/wall panels, or access from underneath, as you say.  Either option would entail a fair amount of upheaval.

Looking at the pics, damp stain 2 is directly beneath the wet room shower tray, stain 1 is beneath the sink. I'm a bit worried about the leak continuing as stain 1 is quite close to the light fixture in the bedroom.  Very often the stain doesn't really indicate where the leak is.  If it's a slow leak (rather than a flood), then water will very often drip along the joists, and emerge quite a way from where the actual leak is.

Thanks.

Some comments in bold above.  Not sure if they help at all, but hopefully they may give you some pointers.

Thanks, that's all really helpful. 

I mean some of the tile grouting does looked cracked actually (see images), do you think this could be the issue and should I simply re-grout or use a clear sealant around the edges of the shower tray and channel?

Exodi

Oh yikes, those pictures don't look good - I'd definitely do that first!

bpk101

Exodi said:

Firstly, I wouldn't bother painting the ceiling until you can confirm the issue.

I doubt it'll disappear because you unclogged the drain but you can't verify either way if you're not using the shower and you don't want to inspect the plumbing.

A clogged pipe doesn't cause it to leak. As above, I agree you should check and re-apply sealant to ensure it's not leaking round the edges of the shower tray (had that before) or plugholes (also had that before!).

Where there is bad access in the bathroom, it's not necessarily the end of the world to open up the ceiling to inspect the pipework, I've done it (and located and fixed a leak on two occasions - as you can probably tell I had a lot of leaks when I first moved into the house, in one day we fixed 5 separate leaks!).

I'd check the sealant, carry on having showers to see if the issue gets worse, if it does probably cut some holes in the ceiling and see if you can locate the issue.

Thanks. Would you suggest re-grouting all of the tiles that sit on top of the shower tray (bigger job), or just apply clear sealant around the edges of the tray where the tiles meet the wall (smaller / easier job)?

Exodi

bpk101 said:

Exodi said:

Firstly, I wouldn't bother painting the ceiling until you can confirm the issue.

I doubt it'll disappear because you unclogged the drain but you can't verify either way if you're not using the shower and you don't want to inspect the plumbing.

A clogged pipe doesn't cause it to leak. As above, I agree you should check and re-apply sealant to ensure it's not leaking round the edges of the shower tray (had that before) or plugholes (also had that before!).

Where there is bad access in the bathroom, it's not necessarily the end of the world to open up the ceiling to inspect the pipework, I've done it (and located and fixed a leak on two occasions - as you can probably tell I had a lot of leaks when I first moved into the house, in one day we fixed 5 separate leaks!).

I'd check the sealant, carry on having showers to see if the issue gets worse, if it does probably cut some holes in the ceiling and see if you can locate the issue.

Thanks. Would you suggest re-grouting all of the tiles that sit on top of the shower tray (bigger job), or just apply clear sealant around the edges of the tray where the tiles meet the wall (smaller / easier job)?

Depends how much of a job you want to make of it. You could use a clear silicon/grout on any gaps and likely resolve the issue (potentially running a bead the whole length of the edge of the shower tray for certainty).

CliveOfIndia

Exodi said:

Oh yikes, those pictures don't look good - I'd definitely do that first!

Agreed.  Re-grouting (making sure you use grout that's designed for showers) is an easy and cheap DIY job.  And judging by those pictures, I wouldn't be at all surprised if that fixes the problem.  There's no harm in removing and replacing any silicone sealant that's in place, as well.  That can be a bit time-consuming, but again there's nothing at all difficult about it, and even top-quality bathroom silicone is not exactly expensive.

Grout and silicone problems are very common in bathrooms, and they do need replacing every so often.  I'd say that's a far more likely cause than any pipework issues.

Dizzycap

CliveOfIndia said:

Exodi said:

Oh yikes, those pictures don't look good - I'd definitely do that first!

Agreed.  Re-grouting (making sure you use grout that's designed for showers) is an easy and cheap DIY job.  And judging by those pictures, I wouldn't be at all surprised if that fixes the problem.  There's no harm in removing and replacing any silicone sealant that's in place, as well.  That can be a bit time-consuming, but again there's nothing at all difficult about it, and even top-quality bathroom silicone is not exactly expensive.

Grout and silicone problems are very common in bathrooms, and they do need replacing every so often.  I'd say that's a far more likely cause than any pipework issues.

bpk101 said:

Exodi said:

Firstly, I wouldn't bother painting the ceiling until you can confirm the issue.

I doubt it'll disappear because you unclogged the drain but you can't verify either way if you're not using the shower and you don't want to inspect the plumbing.

A clogged pipe doesn't cause it to leak. As above, I agree you should check and re-apply sealant to ensure it's not leaking round the edges of the shower tray (had that before) or plugholes (also had that before!).

Where there is bad access in the bathroom, it's not necessarily the end of the world to open up the ceiling to inspect the pipework, I've done it (and located and fixed a leak on two occasions - as you can probably tell I had a lot of leaks when I first moved into the house, in one day we fixed 5 separate leaks!).

I'd check the sealant, carry on having showers to see if the issue gets worse, if it does probably cut some holes in the ceiling and see if you can locate the issue.

Thanks. Would you suggest re-grouting all of the tiles that sit on top of the shower tray (bigger job), or just apply clear sealant around the edges of the tray where the tiles meet the wall (smaller / easier job)?

Personally, I take out all the present grout / sealant, dry clean, check & then redo the whole lot. It might take some time & the shower will have to be out of action during that time, but it will allow for any damp to dry out at the same time. Once all the grout is replaced and left to dry/harden, then should there be any further issues, you know it than has to be something else There's no point in painting until you know you've definately identified the cause of the leak.

bpk101

CliveOfIndia said:

Exodi said:

Oh yikes, those pictures don't look good - I'd definitely do that first!

Agreed.  Re-grouting (making sure you use grout that's designed for showers) is an easy and cheap DIY job.  And judging by those pictures, I wouldn't be at all surprised if that fixes the problem.  There's no harm in removing and replacing any silicone sealant that's in place, as well.  That can be a bit time-consuming, but again there's nothing at all difficult about it, and even top-quality bathroom silicone is not exactly expensive.

Grout and silicone problems are very common in bathrooms, and they do need replacing every so often.  I'd say that's a far more likely cause than any pipework issues.

Thanks. Do you think I need to remove all the grout from the tiles in the shower area first and then re-grout, or just where the gaps have appeared? I imagine small hexagon tiles aren't the easiest tiles to remove grout from for a beginner?

bpk101

CliveOfIndia said:

Exodi said:

Oh yikes, those pictures don't look good - I'd definitely do that first!

Agreed.  Re-grouting (making sure you use grout that's designed for showers)

This is the product that was used previously. You think it's okay to use this again so we get a colour match?