2 Empty Houses & Intestate Situation

RAS

Sorry, IPDI trust appears to have been father's will.

msb1234

runner1977 said:

Thanks for the information @Keep_pedalling
Sounds like I'm going to have to let the solicitor know about both houses/estates and work through them.

Next problem will be that I'm not an executor for my grandparents estate - I think only my Aunty is and she won't want to do it.

From my basic googling I may have to apply to the courts to force probate/winding up of grandparents estate.

Fortunately my Aunty lives on the other side of the country and I rarely see her so any awkwardness will be kept to a minimum!

I do have a will - back in 2017 I saw what was happening and thought "this is going to turn into a right mess" so I sorted my will

You said that your grandparents died intestate and probate wasn’t applied for (to avoid having to declare inheritance to DWP). 

You need to involve a solicitor in this - it’s a massively tangled mess! Who paid for your mother’s care, bearing in mind she should have had the money left to your father from his mother.

runner1977

Thanks everyone - I'm going to ask my solicitor to look into both estates. I was hoping there would be an easy way out but it all sounds very complicated and stressful.

My grandfather never liked me and I'm starting to this he's done this all on purpose

Flugelhorn

runner1977 said:

Thanks everyone - I'm going to ask my solicitor to look into both estates. I was hoping there would be an easy way out but it all sounds very complicated and stressful.

My grandfather never liked me and I'm starting to this he's done this all on purpose

honestly that is the best thing to do and don't hold it against grandad! TBH you haven't done anything wrong - it is those like auntie who failed to declare the asset etc who should be more concerned - this whole thing is going to cost a fair bit to sort  but at least there is money in the estates to pay for it 

madbadrob

Pedalling as advised you that by not obtaining probate to avoid losing any means tested benefit is fraud so i wont go into that.

These estates are all covered by the rules of intestacy.

Therefore on grandmothers death your grandfather becomes entitled to the estate of your grandmother subject to thresholds which in 2015 was the first 250k would go to your grandmother and 50 percent of any money over that amount.  The other 50 percent to your dad and aunt.  However this is now null and void because nan as now died intestate.  Therefore your dad and aunt inherit everything.  As administration as not been granted and your dad as died leaving a will his 50 percent share in grandparents house should be included in the gifts.  

The complications here lie in the fact that your fathers estate for IHT reasons needs to have his share of grandparents property value at time of death included in the probate application.  Im assuming you did apply for probate in 2020.

You dont say if mum left a will
  If she didnt then as you know you receive all of her estate.  

Ultimately you need to tell aunt that you're sorry but legally you have no choice but to put grandparents house through probate and obtain letters of admon.  Once you sell the property you will have cgt to pay from the value at the time of the grandfathers death and value when sold.  There is also the probability that the property could also mean a liability for iht as the values back then were much lower than today before you had to pay it.  I am not sure but i think hmrc can ask for interest as well for all the years of any unpaid IHT.  This could in reality mean that the estimated worth of the estate right now is in fact much less.

There are less risks involved with your parents passing.  As your dad left a will and wife and at that time there was no IHT implications there was no requirement to obtain probate.  Whether you just need letters of admon for your mums estate and probate for dads will depend whose names are on the deeds.  If both mum and dads then you need to know if its joint tenants or tenants in common.  If the former then there is no need to obtain probate for dads estate as the property becomes mums however by the fact your dad left the house equally divided between you and mum would suggest that it was either solely owned or as TIC which in either case will mean probate for dads and letters of administration for mums estate (am assuming she died intestate)

If that is melting your mind id maybe suggest a solicitor may be the best
way to go in this matter.  The cost wont be small but the estate will be sorted correctly and they are insured if anything is missed that in the future could.come back with negative financial consequences for yourself.

Sorry for your loss and good luck in dealing with all of this.  I thought some of the cases ive had to deal with were complicated but id sooner have them than deal with this one

Rob

runner1977

madbadrob that's very useful information for me when meeting solicitor

runner1977

madbadrob many thanks (i did say thank you in my post above but somehow it didn't print it after i posted comment lol)

madbadrob

runner1977 said:

madbadrob many thanks (i did say thank you in my post above but somehow it didn't print it after i posted comment lol)

Its there twice and youre more than welcome.  Id be interested in the future as to what the outcome was in this matter

Rob