Rental Cleaning Deposit Deduction £350 plus Non-Safety Glass?

Grumpy_chap

Beeblebr0x said:

Doesn't the landlord bear responsibility for having non-safety glass in the property in the same way as he/she has to comply with safety requirements for gas boilers etc? It's fortunate a child wasn't injured.

No, not as I understand it.
The glass in that door was probably original build for the property and compliant with the regulations in force at the time.
In the main, new building regulations are not retroactive unless the newly introduced regulations are specific in that regard. 
It arises in fairly frequent comment with regard to electrical inspections where the report nearly always states "installation does not comply with current regulations" - it is a standard scare comment / position protecting comment added by NIC EIC inspectors but, actually, the installation does not need to comply with current regulations, only those in force at the time of the installation.  It would be nonsense otherwise, since every change of regulations would require every property in the land to be completely rewired every time there is an update to the regulations.

Nabla said:

they did not fix it.

That is how it looked after it happened, multiple small shards, one large shard, and multiple medium sized shards fell out.

I reported it the same day, and for the remaining 3-4weeks of my tenancy, I was chasing for them to get a handy man round to fix it and given me a quote. I have the email evidence of me chasing them for this. They did not do anything. 

After the glass was broken, did you do anything to make it safe?
Simple tasks such as taping some solid cardboard over both sides of the glass?
As a Tenant, you will have been required to act in a Tenant-like manner.  That would include the things a normal householder would do and reasonable measures to prevent further harm.

anselld

Nabla said:

I reported it the same day, and for the remaining 3-4weeks of my tenancy, I was chasing for them to get a handy man round to fix it and given me a quote. I have the email evidence of me chasing them for this. They did not do anything. I hen received a quote for £274, two hours after I handed my keys back on the day of leaving. (What a coincidence, right!)

I got an independent quote myself for parts and labour for £180, provided to them, and also found two equivalent doors online (I measured the exact mm dimensions myself before I left), from UK suppliers, with safety glass, both for <£100 with shipping. It needed the old door unscrewing from the hinges, and the new door screwing on. That's it.

If you had the quotes there was nothing stopping you fixing it yourself.  £180 does sound about right.  You would find that fitting a door is not quite as simple as screwing it to the existing hinges.

silvercar

Grumpy_chap said:

Beeblebr0x said:

Doesn't the landlord bear responsibility for having non-safety glass in the property in the same way as he/she has to comply with safety requirements for gas boilers etc? It's fortunate a child wasn't injured.

No, not as I understand it.
The glass in that door was probably original build for the property and compliant with the regulations in force at the time.
In the main, new building regulations are not retroactive unless the newly introduced regulations are specific in that regard. 
It arises in fairly frequent comment with regard to electrical inspections where the report nearly always states "installation does not comply with current regulations" - it is a standard scare comment / position protecting comment added by NIC EIC inspectors but, actually, the installation does not need to comply with current regulations, only those in force at the time of the installation.  It would be nonsense otherwise, since every change of regulations would require every property in the land to be completely rewired every time there is an update to the regulations.

Nabla said:

they did not fix it.

That is how it looked after it happened, multiple small shards, one large shard, and multiple medium sized shards fell out.

I reported it the same day, and for the remaining 3-4weeks of my tenancy, I was chasing for them to get a handy man round to fix it and given me a quote. I have the email evidence of me chasing them for this. They did not do anything. 

After the glass was broken, did you do anything to make it safe?
Simple tasks such as taping some solid cardboard over both sides of the glass?
As a Tenant, you will have been required to act in a Tenant-like manner.  That would include the things a normal householder would do and reasonable measures to prevent further harm.

This. You are required to behave responsibly. That means covering both sides of the glass or removing all the glass to make it temporarily safe.

I don't think it is any different to if they had left exposed mains wiring and I had electrocuted myself (Yes, they could say it was my fault for touching the wire, but it should never have been exposed in the first place - an accident waiting to happen.) 

the difference with open wiring and this glass is that you broke it! So compare it to you exposing open wiring eg by putting too much weight on a light fitting so it comes away in your hands, leaving the exposed wiring behind. 

Beeblebr0x

Whilst taking on board the impracticality of rewiring a property every time the regs are updated, I would've thought there's a difference between electrical fittings that are safe if untampered with and a glass door where someone could fall through it.

Grumpy_chap

Beeblebr0x said:

Whilst taking on board the impracticality of rewiring a property every time the regs are updated, I would've thought there's a difference between electrical fittings that are safe if untampered with and a glass door where someone could fall through it.

There are many, many, many glass doors of that type installed across the country.
They complied with regulations when originally installed.

Beeblebr0x

Grumpy_chap said:

Beeblebr0x said:

Whilst taking on board the impracticality of rewiring a property every time the regs are updated, I would've thought there's a difference between electrical fittings that are safe if untampered with and a glass door where someone could fall through it.

There are many, many, many glass doors of that type installed across the country.
They complied with regulations when originally installed.

I wouldn't expect to see those glass doors in a nursery built decades ago. We already have regulations regarding gas boilers in rented accommodation for good reason.

Grumpy_chap

Beeblebr0x said:

I wouldn't expect to see those glass doors in a nursery built decades ago. We already have regulations regarding gas boilers in rented accommodation for good reason.

I don't know why the reference to a nursery is relevant.  The OP lived in an apartment:

Nabla said:

I moved out of a rental place (2 bed apartment, 1 bathroom, 1 kitchen, 1 living room, no outdoor space) 

The OP's glass door is not covered by regulations regarding gas boilers.

You seem to be trying to impose a standard on this property that is what you think it should be, not what the regulations require it to be.  If you think the regulations are insufficient, or should be applied retrospectively to existing housing stock, the approach would be to lobby your MP.
If the aim is to help the OP with their immediate issue, this needs to be in the context of actual situation and actual regulations as they are at present.

Are you able to cite a regulation that required the retrospective remedy of all pre-existing internal glass panel doors to safety glass?

newsgroupmonkey_

Not a cat in hell's chance the Lawyer will win this.

FlorayG

OP as the LL did not inspect immediately them you probably have a case on the cleaning; only because of that though. Most properties require a professional deep clean when being re-let you would be surprised at the standard of 'clean' this gives them; however, the inspection was not done as you left so you can argue any dirt came after you left. Also if I were you I would get some quotes for deep cleaning a same size apartment to present as evidence of your side of the cost. The last deep clean I had was £150 not including the carpets - carpets were £280. Tenant had dogs so agreed to the cost
As for the glass door, you can try it but I think you will get nowhere

Beeblebr0x

Grumpy_chap said:

Beeblebr0x said:

I wouldn't expect to see those glass doors in a nursery built decades ago. We already have regulations regarding gas boilers in rented accommodation for good reason.

I don't know why the reference to a nursery is relevant.  The OP lived in an apartment:

Nabla said:

I moved out of a rental place (2 bed apartment, 1 bathroom, 1 kitchen, 1 living room, no outdoor space) 

The OP's glass door is not covered by regulations regarding gas boilers.

You seem to be trying to impose a standard on this property that is what you think it should be, not what the regulations require it to be.  If you think the regulations are insufficient, or should be applied retrospectively to existing housing stock, the approach would be to lobby your MP.
If the aim is to help the OP with their immediate issue, this needs to be in the context of actual situation and actual regulations as they are at present.

Are you able to cite a regulation that required the retrospective remedy of all pre-existing internal glass panel doors to safety glass?

The broader reference to a nursery relates to child safety. 
I never said the glass door is covered by gas boiler regs!
Correct, I do think regs are insufficient. Obviously there isn't a reg that requires the upgrade of all PEIGP doors to safety glass.