Britannia/DCB Legal PCN - CNBC Claim - Comments on defence answers 3 and 4 please

Kernowfornia

Hi everyone,

I have read through all the newbies thread and understood most of the process, and was hoping for some assistance with the date I have to submit defence via email by and comment on my draft.

I have calculated that I need to submit the defence by Sunday 22 March at 4pm. But does this get moved forward due to it being the weekend? Therefore, is it Friday 20 March 4pm?

If someone could please comment on 3 and 4 as these have been slightly amended from the versions in the template and taken from others on the forum and combined.

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6576011/cel-dcb-legal-pcn-cnbc-claim-defence-assistance-required-please

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6590389/g24-dcb-legal-pcn-cnbc-claim-help-with-defence-assistance-required?utm_source=community-search&utm_medium=organic-search&utm_term=defence+3

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6583523/advice-on-paragraph-2-3-of-defence/p1

Context: I was dropping friends off to the pub and picking them up when it shut. I never exited the vehicle. Signs are not lit and I was not aware charging was in place. Yes, I did get chatting with one of the girls in the car at drop off! On the pick up waiting for drunk people to get into the car. Landlady confirmed in September and October that they had been contacted to cancel (I can only assume Britannia).

Entry: 09/08/2024 21:11:05                        Exit: 21:43:43

Entry 10/08/2024 0:01:12                           Exit: 0:14:30

Thanks in advance of any feedback on the below.

- Claim Form (Civil National Business Centre) issue date 18 Feb 2025

- DCB Legal Ltd representing Britannia Parking Group Ltd

- AOS submitted via MCOL 23/02/25

- I have done nothing else on MCOL, treating as read-only

 

PoC:

Particulars of Claim 1. The Defendant (D) is indebted to the Claimant (C) for a Parking Charge issued to vehicle XXXXXXX at XXXXXX Car Park.

2. The PCN(s) were issued on 09/08/2024, 10/08/2024

3. The defendant is pursued as the driver of the vehicle for breach of the terms on the signs (the contract). Reason:Failed TO Validate Stay or Make A Valid Payment

4. In the alternative the defendant is pursued as the keeper pursuant to POFA 2012, Schedule  4.

AND THE CLAIMANT CLAIMS

1. £340 being the total of the PCN(s) and damages.

2. Interest at a rate of 8% per annum pursuant to s.69 of the County Courts Act 1984 from the date hereof at a daily rate of £.06 until judgment or sooner payment.

3. Costs and court fees

 

** DRAFT **

3. Referring to the POC: paragraph 1 is denied. The Defendant is not indebted to the Claimant. Paragraph 2 is denied. No PCNs were "issued on 09/08/2024, 10/08/2024” (the dates of the alleged visits).  Whilst the Defendant is the registered keeper, paragraphs 3 and 4 are denied. The Defendant is not liable and has seen no evidence of a breach of prominent terms.  The quantum is hugely exaggerated (no PCNs can be £170 on private land, a total of £340) and there were no damages incurred whatsoever. The Claimant is put to strict proof of all of their allegations.

3.1 The vehicle was never parked and no "parking contract" supposedly offered by the Claimant was accepted or entered into by performance. The vehicle was only there to drop of passengers and pick up passengers from the location.

3.2  The Department for Levelling Up, Housing and Communities ('DLUHC') published in February 2022, 

“a Private Parking Code of Practice includes the following two points which highlight that dropping a passenger or picking them up is not considered parking:

2.19 parked/parking

an instance of a vehicle being caused by the driver to remain stationary other than in the course of driving (excluding instances where the driver has stopped to enable passengers leave or enter the vehicle)

A vehicle may be deemed to be parked whether or not the driver has left the vehicle or turned off the ignition

2.24 parking period

the length of time that a vehicle has been parked, i.e. left stationary otherwise than in the course of driving, after any relevant consideration period has expired (excluding instances where the driver has stopped to enable passengers to leave or enter the vehicle) This is not the period between a vehicle being recorded as entering and departing controlled land.”

3.3 The signage provided at the car park entrance is barely legible from a moving vehicle upon entering, and the tiny signs setting out the terms of parking are completely unreadable unless standing directly in front of the aforementioned sign. See paragraph 24 for relevant remarks from ParkingEye vs Beavis regarding small signage and minuscule font.

4. The Claimant should reasonably concede that no financial loss to a parking operator can arise in a case where there was no 'parking period.' The fact that ANPR-using parking operators cannot tell which drivers actually park and leave a vehicle, as opposed to those drivers who don't, is the Claimant's problem caused by their choice to use remote cameras to run the cheapest regime possible. At most, the sum due could be under a pound but the simple fact is the Claimants cannot charge a driver anything in a case where there was no parking period. In order to impose an inflated parking charge, as well as proving a term was breached, there must be:

(i). a strong 'legitimate interest' extending beyond mere compensation for loss, and

(Ii). 'adequate notice' of the 'penalty clause' charge which, in the case of a car park, requires prominent signs and lines.

KeithP

Kernowfornia said:

- Claim Form (Civil National Business Centre) issue date 18 Feb 2025
- AOS submitted via MCOL 23/02/25 

With a Claim Issue Date of 18th February, and having filed an Acknowledgment of Service('AOS') in a timely manner, you have until 4pm on Monday 24th March 2025 to file a Defence.

That's nearly two weeks away and it is good to see that you are not leaving it to the last minute.

To create a Defence, and then file a Defence by email, look at the second post in the NEWBIES thread.

Don't miss the deadline for filing a Defence.

Do not try and file a Defence via the MoneyClaimOnline website. Once an AOS has been filed, the MCOL website should be treated as 'read only'.

Coupon-mad

Nice defence. Good research. 

Kernowfornia

Thank you both for replying. I will get this off and continue to follow the guidance that you have so kindly spent your time creating and also all your responses to those who post.

Kernowfornia

Just checking in, a bit of advice needed!

Please bear with the questions below, I am going through the menopause and my brain does not function like it once did!

I have studied the forums and followed all the advice (thank goodness those that give their advice and time, I very much appreciate it). Mediation took place at the beginning of July and settlement could not be reached. 

I have now received my hearing date for the middle of October and whilst I await a copy of the claimants written statement, I am starting to gather information, especially photographic evidence.

Luckily for me I live close to the offending place where the event took place. I visited yesterday and took photos of the signage during the day and and in similar light conditions to when the event took place.

Photos

Image 1 - (I have redacted the car park name before posting)
Apart from the ridiculously small text (as per most signs). Does the use of the word "may" in the sentence
"A Parking Charge Notice of £100 may be issued to vehicles which:" have any relevance that it should be included in my witness statement? 



Image 2 - taken during day light
The entrance parking sign is on the left, covered with a surfboard


Image 3 - taken during same light conditions as time of event
The entrance parking sign is on the left, covered with a surfboard


Image 4 - taken during same light conditions as time of event
Close up of the entrance parking sign is on the left, covered with a surfboard


Do images 2, 3 and 4 help? Especially given that the sign has been very much obscured. 
In addition to the above photos I have others showing that as you drive in you cannot see signs, especially where the car was located. The sign on exit is also obscured with a banner. No signs are lit.

Email received

This morning I have also received an email from the claimants legal team, DCB Legal. 

"Dear xxx,

Re: Our Client: Britannia Parking Group Ltd

Claim Number: xxxx 

WITHOUT PREJUDICE SAVE AS TO COSTS

We write to you in relation to the above matter.

To assist the Court in achieving its overriding objective, our Client may be prepared to settle this case. I can confirm our Client would be agreeable to £xxx.xx in full and final settlement of this Claim. The current outstanding balance is £xx.xx.　

Should you be agreeable to this offer, please make payment within 7 days. Payment can be made via our website xxxxx by calling our office on xxxxxxxxxx or via bank transfer:　

　　

DCB Legal Ltd Client Account　　

Sort Code: xx-xx-xx　　

Account no: xxxxxxxx　　　　

When making payment please ensure you include the following reference number, xxxxxx.xxxxxx, to enable us to allocate it to the correct case. 　

Upon receipt of the settlement sum of £xxx.xx we will update the Court that the matter has been settled. If you are not agreeable, we will continue to follow the Court process as normal.　

Kind Regards,"

I am just checking this is their usual last ditch attempt and getting some money before court? For information the current amount being sought through the court is in excess of £450, the amount in the proposed settlement is in excess of £150.

Written Statement

I have looked and seen the following posts that look helpful in terms of layout and content, in addition to the ones detailed in the post 2 on the Newbies forum. (I have a very visual learner, so these are great for me). As mentioned previously I am also awaiting the claimants written statement before fully pulling this together. 

I was wondering if others think they are a good base to work from? (Acknowledging there is tweaking for my case, also the responses the original poster received about these posts)

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78405139/#Comment_78405139

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/78405141/#Comment_78405141

Advice gratefully received. Unsure how this racket it still being allowed to happen! 

Coupon-mad

All this looks great. Yes those pics are useful as long as you include the metadata when you exhibit photographs.

And you say that the principal - the pub - wanted these PCNs cancelled and they asked Britannia to do so. Can you get a witness statement confirming that was true?

DCB Legal will probably discontinue before having to pay the hearing fee but prepare anyway.

Questions:

Does the company number for 'Britannia' on the sign EXACTLY match the company number on the postal PCN?

And does the name of the Claimant as written on the Claim form EXACTLY match the name on the sign and the name on the postal PCN?

Kernowfornia

Thanks for the swift reply.

Regarding the company number, sadly it is an exact match.

However, the name of the claimant is not an exact match. On the claim form it reads as below:
BRITANNIA PARKING GROUP LTD
7TH FLOOR
300 COUNTY GATES HOUSE
POOLE ROAD
BH12 1AZ

They have added a LTD at the end, also the 300 is in front of County Gates House, no 300 Poole Road as on the sign.

I can go back to the Landlady as she did say she had emailed and ask for her for a witness statement. She can be a bit up and down, but if you don't ask you don't get!

Kernowfornia

Extra info...

A missed call from DCB Legal this morning, with an answer phone message to ring them. 

I am unable to as busy preparing witness statements.

Gr1pr

Ignore them,  they will badger and bully,  relentless 

Coupon-mad

Kernowfornia said:

Extra info...

A missed call from DCB Legal this morning, with an answer phone message to ring them. 

I am unable to as busy preparing witness statements.

This means they are about to discontinue!

"Unsure how this racket is still being allowed to happen!"

Agreed ... please join us in stopping it:

FIGHTBACK ALERT:

Please do the government's Public Consultation. We need every poster to complete this vital survey before the deadline.

See this thread:

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6617396/parking-code-of-practice-consultation-now-extended-closes-friday-26th-september/p1

We understand that you may need some pointers. It looks laborious, we get that. It doesn't matter; no knowledge is needed except re your own experiences so you can call out a scam industry and you'll protect millions of motorists and help change the law. 

I've written some guidance to help focus new posters on the issues. I've covered almost every question, providing ideas if you agree with our stance on things like DRFs, which we say must be banned.

Ordinary people like you are falling victim to this scam 15 million times per annum. Motorists need your voice added please.

CLOSES ON FRIDAY 26th SEPTEMBER.

Kernowfornia

Dear Forumites,

Just to let you know that I received an email today advising that Britannia has instructed DCB to discontinue Court proceedings and close the file. 

I would like to thank all those that have personally replied to my questions, and also all those that contribute to the advice on the newbies threads and others. It gave me the confidence to defend and not have to pay these extortionate fines.