Zero standing charge tariff proposal

Swipe

It's very disappointing from Martin pushing for this, especially after shafting everyone with the telephone and broadband CPI + 3.9% changes now that inflation has fallen.

wrf12345

You can't help the poor by increasing the energy cost for those who already pay income tax because their money has already been redistributed to help the poor, so they would be taxed twice - which would happen if you had a social tariff only available to those on benefits.

With Ofgem's plans, the extra cost for high users will be trivial compared to the variations in the unit cost which already exist due to supply/demand and they are doing terrible damage to the grid by using too much energy, so arguably should be paying a second tier, much higher, unit rate to discourage them. It is going to be a terrible mess only because Ofgem can't get its head around completely getting rid of the s/c for everyone, compensated by a slight increase in the unit tate, rather than almost doubling it, which is what the charities are objecting to.

Spoonie_Turtle

wrf12345 said:

With Ofgem's plans, the extra cost for high users will be trivial compared to the variations in the unit cost which already exist due to supply/demand and they are doing terrible damage to the grid by using too much energy, so arguably should be paying a second tier, much higher, unit rate to discourage them. It is going to be a terrible mess only because Ofgem can't get its head around completely getting rid of the s/c for everyone, compensated by a slight increase in the unit tate, rather than almost doubling it, which is what the charities are objecting to.

You seem to have missed the 'not by choice' part applying to those higher users who are poorer people living in badly insulated homes and/or disadvantaged in some other way (e.g. medical equipment or medical requirement for higher heating driving their high usage).

Qyburn

Swipe said:

It's very disappointing from Martin pushing for this, especially after shafting everyone with the telephone and broadband CPI + 3.9% changes now that inflation has fallen.

What do you expect, jumping onto anything that gets him a bit of media attention.

bob2302

FreeBear said:

wrf12345 said:

On dead smart meters, does not the Octopus Mini IHD thingie overcome this problem, as long as you have a router and are with Octopus, as they can get the info from the Mini?

No. Because of the way things currently stand, data from the Home Mini can not be used for billing purposes.

The firmware and hardware has not been certified, and it is very easy to hack in to the device and inject false data - Have one here, and opened it up to see what is inside. A small module to communicate with the meter(s), and another to handle the WiFi connection. The designers very thoughtfully included two sets of debugging ports that can be plugged in to with some basic (and cheap) probes, so it is possible to inject false data. Consequently, it fails to meet the required standards of security.

I doubt that's the real reason given that they accept manual readings. I think it probably has more to do with not wanting to take responsibility for bugs.

HillStreetBlues

Qyburn said:

Swipe said:

It's very disappointing from Martin pushing for this, especially after shafting everyone with the telephone and broadband CPI + 3.9% changes now that inflation has fallen.

What do you expect, jumping onto anything that gets him a bit of media attention.

Like a lot of stuff, it's robbing Peter to pay Paul, for Paul you're the hero.

wrf12345

New s/c's out today for April, up for gas, down for electric - by quite a lot - in most areas except London. Vast amounts of excess money swirling around the large energy retailers that would more than cover getting rid of s/c's.

housebuyer143

Ectophile said:

GingerTim said:

• Falling block tariffs, where customers would pay a higher unit rate until a certain amount of energy is used, and then a lower rate thereafter. 

Suppliers used to offer those.  But Ofgem banned them as they were too confusing to customers.  Now Ofgem is proposing to re-introduce them.

It's like customers and ofgem themselves have these ridiculously short memories. I was on his tariff before ofgem banned them and my bill went up £20 a month overnight. 
Overregulation is a thing and I sometimes think this is what is happening now.

Qyburn

wrf12345 said:

Vast amounts of excess money swirling around the large energy retailers that would more than cover getting rid of s/c's.

Source for that assertion? I see Octopus' annual profit mentioned as £83 million, but the annual standing charges from their customer must be over £2 billion.

MattMattMattUK

wrf12345 said:

With Ofgem's plans, the extra cost for high users will be trivial compared to the variations in the unit cost which already exist due to supply/demand

The cost increase if they were on a zero standing charge tariff would be huge, for the top third of users their bills would more than double.

wrf12345 said:

they are doing terrible damage to the grid by using too much energy, so arguably should be paying a second tier, much higher, unit rate to discourage them.

They are not doing any damage to the grid, it would really make sense to educate yourself before posting.

wrf12345 said:

It is going to be a terrible mess only because Ofgem can't get its head around completely getting rid of the s/c for everyone, compensated by a slight increase in the unit tate, rather than almost doubling it, which is what the charities are objecting to.

A slightly increase in the unit rate will not cover the costs. You seem to continually fail to understand that the suppliers are not making huge margins which can used to cut bills, their net margins are around 3%, not the 50% rate that you seem to delusionally believe that they make. 

wrf12345 said:

New s/c's out today for April, up for gas, down for electric - by quite a lot - in most areas except London. Vast amounts of excess money swirling around the large energy retailers that would more than cover getting rid of s/c's.

There is not "excess money swirling around", have you ever actually bothered to read the published data that shows the profit the energy suppliers make? If the standing charge was abolished and suppliers were made to swallow the cost they would all be insolvent by the end of the year. 

Why do you keep posting the same factually inaccurate statements again and again?