NHS Pension Gross Misconduct

1813

What happens to your NHS Pension if you are sacked for Gross Misconduct? Do you lose it or do you only lose it if you are sacked for Gross Misconduct that is related to a criminal offence? I’m sorry to ask but I am just a bit concerned. Thanks.

Dazed_and_C0nfused

A start?

https://faq.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/knowledgebase/article/KA-04628/en-us

Aretnap

It is rather difficult to lose your pension rights through misconduct. The notion of being sacked without pension mostly comes from American TV.

If you steal from the NHS or cause then a large loss through misconduct the money can be recovered from your pension, which isn't quite the same as losing your pension rights. Or you can lose then if you are convicted of certain very serious offences - hopefully you haven't been accused of treason!

https://www.nhsbsa.nhs.uk/reduction-or-forfeiture-nhs-pension-scheme-benefits-and-using-02-exit-code

Added: ISTR Harold Shipman timed his suicide to make sure his wife got the full benefit of his NHS pension, which gives you an idea of the sort of thing you CAN do and still keep your pension rights.

(Though I think the law might have been changed in respond to the Harold Shipman thing, so don't take "you can murder your patients and keep your pension" as formal legal or financial advice.)

elsien

Aretnap said:

…..

(Though I think the law might have been changed in respond to the Harold Shipman thing, so don't take "you can murder your patients and keep your pension" as formal legal or financial advice.)

Without wanting to distract from the OP concerns, that’s probably one of the best answers  I’ve read on here in a while.

Flugelhorn

elsien said:

Aretnap said:

…..

(Though I think the law might have been changed in respond to the Harold Shipman thing, so don't take "you can murder your patients and keep your pension" as formal legal or financial advice.)

Without wanting to distract from the OP concerns, that’s probably one of the best answers  I’ve read on here in a while.

He also had the biggest obituary I have ever seen in the British Medical Journal.

OP have you cost the NHS money in what you did?

1813

Basically I swore at my boss under duress under my breath and I felt a colleague after was laughing at me when it happened so I asked her to mind her own business and in the office with the person I swore at, I stood by her and said her attitude was disgusting. I was under duress at the time as she was making my life very difficult and I felt I could do nothing right and the changes in the NHS were worrying me in regards of the transition to digital. 

Flugelhorn

doesn't sound like negligence , a criminal offence  or loss of money to NHS

FIREDreamer

1813 said:

Basically I swore at my boss under duress under my breath and I felt a colleague after was laughing at me when it happened so I asked her to mind her own business and in the office with the person I swore at, I stood by her and said her attitude was disgusting. I was under duress at the time as she was making my life very difficult and I felt I could do nothing right and the changes in the NHS were worrying me in regards of the transition to digital. 

Shouldn’t lose your pension for that.

However if you leave with under 2 years service you probably only get a refund of contributions or a transfer value, not a deferred pension.

GrubbyGirl_2

1813 said:

Basically I swore at my boss under duress under my breath and I felt a colleague after was laughing at me when it happened so I asked her to mind her own business and in the office with the person I swore at, I stood by her and said her attitude was disgusting. I was under duress at the time as she was making my life very difficult and I felt I could do nothing right and the changes in the NHS were worrying me in regards of the transition to digital. 

That really doesn't sound like gross misconduct warranting instant dismissal though might fall into final written warning territory.  It certainly is not criminal and won't affect your pension.  I presume your union is involved?  Have you spoken to HR?   If your boss is taking you down the gross misconduct route and you don't have a union then I would suggest having a free initial conversation with an employment solicitor.

All that said as a retired NHS senior manager

Flugelhorn

GrubbyGirl_2 said:

1813 said:

Basically I swore at my boss under duress under my breath and I felt a colleague after was laughing at me when it happened so I asked her to mind her own business and in the office with the person I swore at, I stood by her and said her attitude was disgusting. I was under duress at the time as she was making my life very difficult and I felt I could do nothing right and the changes in the NHS were worrying me in regards of the transition to digital. 

That really doesn't sound like gross misconduct warranting instant dismissal though might fall into final written warning territory.  It certainly is not criminal and won't affect your pension.  I presume your union is involved?  Have you spoken to HR?   If your boss is taking you down the gross misconduct route and you don't have a union then I would suggest having a free initial conversation with an employment solicitor.

All that said as a retired NHS senior manager

Must say it sounds like a bit of a crabby day in the NHS, tempers get frayed but instant dismissal sounds a bit drastic

Aretnap

Probably more of a question for the employment board at this point but I agree that didn't sound like the sort of things that should cost you your job unless you already have a significant disciplinary record. Certainly not something that's going to cost you your pension.