Immediate Post Death Trust

Snookie12cat

My dad died and wrote his will in such a way that he left half the house to me and a lifetime interest to my mum. I have been reading and it seems like an IPDT has been created? Please correct me if I am wrong.
I looked into how to go about registering this and that seems okay and straightforward at HMRC but I was wondering where the details of the trust are written, as in the trusts assets etc. Would this just be the will or do I need to document this somewhere else? HMRC doesn't seem to ask this as part of the trust registration process. 

The will was just written by my dad so its lacking detail on the trust, but I know what it was he intended when writing it.

Are there any other ways we can essentially give my mum a life interest without setting up a trust? My dad wanted her to be able to downsize and if there was any money left from my half after this, this was to be paid out immediately - I am not sure though if this is possible? If it is, can someone explain how I can do this?

Emmia

Snookie12cat said:

My dad died and wrote his will in such a way that he left half the house to me and a lifetime interest to my mum. I have been reading and it seems like an IPDT has been created? Please correct me if I am wrong.
I looked into how to go about registering this and that seems okay and straightforward at HMRC but I was wondering where the details of the trust are written, as in the trusts assets etc. Would this just be the will or do I need to document this somewhere else? HMRC doesn't seem to ask this as part of the trust registration process. 

The will was just written by my dad so its lacking detail on the trust, but I know what it was he intended when writing it.

Are there any other ways we can essentially give my mum a life interest without setting up a trust? My dad wanted her to be able to downsize and if there was any money left from my half after this, this was to be paid out immediately - I am not sure though if this is possible? If it is, can someone explain how I can do this?

Can I double check, was the will self-drafted by your father? Are you sure it was done correctly in terms of witnessing etc. you may want/need to seek legal advice.

Snookie12cat

Emmia said:

Snookie12cat said:

My dad died and wrote his will in such a way that he left half the house to me and a lifetime interest to my mum. I have been reading and it seems like an IPDT has been created? Please correct me if I am wrong.
I looked into how to go about registering this and that seems okay and straightforward at HMRC but I was wondering where the details of the trust are written, as in the trusts assets etc. Would this just be the will or do I need to document this somewhere else? HMRC doesn't seem to ask this as part of the trust registration process. 

The will was just written by my dad so its lacking detail on the trust, but I know what it was he intended when writing it.

Are there any other ways we can essentially give my mum a life interest without setting up a trust? My dad wanted her to be able to downsize and if there was any money left from my half after this, this was to be paid out immediately - I am not sure though if this is possible? If it is, can someone explain how I can do this?

Can I double check, was the will self-drafted by your father? Are you sure it was done correctly in terms of witnessing etc. you may want/need to seek legal advice.

Yes, it was self drafted but it seems like it's valid because it's got the two witnesses etc. It's just a little vague unfortunately. 

spreadsheeterapple

You need qualified legal advice, not this forum. You might strike lucky to get a legal professional reading, but how likely? Some solicitors will do a fixed-fee appointment for a fixed amount of time; worth asking.

The potential to get it wrong could be costly in the future, when it comes to both tax and possible financial assessment for mum for care fees, if it ever came to that. If the trust you think you are correctly setting up falls foul of some obscure legal rule, the whole thing could be voided; same goes for the will tbh as it might not be validly written to create the trust properly.

Snookie12cat

spreadsheeterapple said:

You need qualified legal advice, not this forum. You might strike lucky to get a legal professional reading, but how likely? Some solicitors will do a fixed-fee appointment for a fixed amount of time; worth asking.

The potential to get it wrong could be costly in the future, when it comes to both tax and possible financial assessment for mum for care fees, if it ever came to that. If the trust you think you are correctly setting up falls foul of some obscure legal rule, the whole thing could be voided; same goes for the will tbh as it might not be validly written to create the trust properly.

Thanks, that's kind of what I thought but begrudged paying someone, but in this case it might be worth it. I understand why my dad did it, but it's a headache now especially as what he wrote might not even be possible 😞 

Emmia

Snookie12cat said:

Emmia said:

Snookie12cat said:

My dad died and wrote his will in such a way that he left half the house to me and a lifetime interest to my mum. I have been reading and it seems like an IPDT has been created? Please correct me if I am wrong.
I looked into how to go about registering this and that seems okay and straightforward at HMRC but I was wondering where the details of the trust are written, as in the trusts assets etc. Would this just be the will or do I need to document this somewhere else? HMRC doesn't seem to ask this as part of the trust registration process. 

The will was just written by my dad so its lacking detail on the trust, but I know what it was he intended when writing it.

Are there any other ways we can essentially give my mum a life interest without setting up a trust? My dad wanted her to be able to downsize and if there was any money left from my half after this, this was to be paid out immediately - I am not sure though if this is possible? If it is, can someone explain how I can do this?

Can I double check, was the will self-drafted by your father? Are you sure it was done correctly in terms of witnessing etc. you may want/need to seek legal advice.

Yes, it was self drafted but it seems like it's valid because it's got the two witnesses etc. It's just a little vague unfortunately. 

Did those witnesses see your father signing and sign at the same time? I really would go and seek legal advice on this as it's possible the will is invalid.

Keep_pedalling

Have you checked the land registry to clarify how the joint ownership was held. If it was originally as Joint tenants then as well as the will your father should have severed the tenancy otherwise your mother automatically became the sole owner on his death and the bequest fails as it is a non heritable asset.  I would establish this first before taking legal advice on the will.

https://hmlandregistry.blog.gov.uk/2022/11/02/what-kind-of-joint-ownership-do-i-have/

Snookie12cat

Keep_pedalling said:

Have you checked the land registry to clarify how the joint ownership was held. If it was originally as Joint tenants then as well as the will your father should have severed the tenancy otherwise your mother automatically became the sole owner on his death and the bequest fails as it is a non heritable asset.  I would establish this first before taking legal advice on the will.

https://hmlandregistry.blog.gov.uk/2022/11/02/what-kind-of-joint-ownership-do-i-have/

Yes, it's tenants in common and I am confident the will is valid, it's been signed, dated and witnessed. 

I will speak to someone though about the best way to move forward because this is probably outside my abilities unfortunately. 

DippySkippy

I'd see if you can get a deed of variation done to remove the Trust - they just appear to be made for wasting money

mattojgb

How it actually works depends on the precise wording of the will and you would need the advice of a suitable solicitor. Generally, without any further specifics in the will or an associated trust document, a right to occupy trust will terminate on sale of the trust property and the whole of the beneficiaries share should be paid at that point. There are tax implications.

Keep_pedalling

DippySkippy said:

I'd see if you can get a deed of variation done to remove the Trust - they just appear to be made for wasting money

Immediate post death interest trusts are common, and where it involves a marital home it has no ongoing costs, provides protection both for the beneficiaries and surviving spouse and is tax efficient, so your perception is wrong.