Train delays caused missed appointment

New_in_the_fens

When I’m using the train for something important (commuting excluded 😉) I always go for the train before the one I really need. 

I take the view that if I get that train, I’ll be in good time and can grab a coffee and chill. If that train is cancelled or late, either the following train will get me in on time, or I have some leeway to see if I can get a solution. 

It’s the same with driving though - if I’m in Devon, I always double the predicted journey time 😂 elsewhere I add on a contingency, depending on distance and what I know about the area. 

DullGreyGuy

New_in_the_fens said:

I take the view that if I get that train, I’ll be in good time and can grab a coffee and chill. If that train is cancelled or late, either the following train will get me in on time, or I have some leeway to see if I can get a solution. 

Sounds like you are on a half decent line. When I lived outside of London and commuted in we were on a little branch line and were the sacrificial lamb. Used to go to the station to go back home with a colleague, have a couple of beers and then go on our seperate trains. Unfortunately his station is known for jumpers however they have 6-8 trains an hour, after a fatality half the trains would be cancelled, the other half would be running but naturally rammed. My trains were 2 an hour.

Despite the trains having no common rail after the M25 he'd still have 3-4 trains an hour running but my trains would be cancelled for 3-4 hours. Allowing 1 trains grace can be far from sufficient if you want to guarantee getting there on time. 

itwasntme001

Fair enough about not being able to claim anything but the train ticket from the train company.  I did leave to expect to get there 20min earlier, which I thought was enough for a 25min journey (there was further travel but that would have been by tube which is almost always reliable).  But obviously should leave at least an hour to be on the safe side but even then that is no guarantee.

Nothing life threatening or invasive with regards to the medical appointment.  Obviously I will not be aggressive with reducing the late fee (which amounts to just under £200).  But I will try to get more off, given this was completely out of control and I have already booked another appointment.

It still baffles me how a tresspasser can cause delays of close to an hour!  Surely you would ge the police to come over, arrest the person and that is the end of that?  All within 20min at most?

Okell

DullGreyGuy said:

Okell said:

itwasntme001 said:

400ixl said:

Yep, you will likely be eligible for delay repay from the train operator.

The fact that you did not allow enough time to take a delay into account is not the train lines problem and they are not responsible for any consequential losses.

I already allowed 20min.  How much time should I have allowed?  Given the delay it looks like 1 hour minimum?

I mean seriously, should I really have to allow 1 hour delays everytime I want to take the train for an appointment?

If I had to travel to a private medical appointment and it was far enough away to require travel by train, I'd start by allowing two hours.

Travelling by train doesn't necessarily mean its far, sometimes its just the most convenient method. We seem to be assuming, including me, that the delay was prior to boarding or the train was just on a go slow. It can be the train stops between stations and you're just stuck. Still would have allowed more than 20 minutes but it eliminates switching to another transport method.

A friend took the Stourbridge Shuttle, the whole line is 0.8 miles, was stuck on it for far longer than the 3 minutes it takes end to end because if there is a problem they still won't just open the doors and allow you to wander on the line etc. 

I used to travel extensively by train for work throughout the south-east and midland regions.  Shortest regular journey was 14 minutes and longest 3 hours plus including changing in London.  (It was cheaper than giving me a lease car, apparently, and I could work on the train)

For the 14 minute journey I'd aim at arriving at least an hour before the meeting.  Going to London or further (over two hours) I'd allow two hours.  Arriving early is rarely a problem.

I once had to get a £100 taxi journey authorised in place of a one hour train journey when the train was unexpectedly cancelled and - for once - I hadn't left enough time to allow a later train to get me there.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

If the expectation is to leave at least an hour early if travelling by train all I can say is I’m glad I don’t have to rely on trains!...

Train travel can be inherently unreliable and length of delay wholly unpredictable.

But as long as you can be patient and you know to allow for potentially lengthy delays it's less stressful than other modes of travel and you can get a lot of work done.

Sometimes it's easier to arrive the day before...

p00hsticks

itwasntme001 said:

It still baffles me how a tresspasser can cause delays of close to an hour!  Surely you would ge the police to come over, arrest the person and that is the end of that?  All within 20min at most?

Well,  they have to find the person first. The chances are that the British Transport Police will have just received a phone call that there is someone on the line withe a rough indication of the location. They then have to get there themselves and try to locate the person and, if they can;t spot them, make 100% sure that the line is clear.

In my experience, it's often turned out to be someone simply taking  short cut and by the time the police get their they've disappeared of the line...

DullGreyGuy

Okell said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Okell said:

itwasntme001 said:

400ixl said:

Yep, you will likely be eligible for delay repay from the train operator.

The fact that you did not allow enough time to take a delay into account is not the train lines problem and they are not responsible for any consequential losses.

I already allowed 20min.  How much time should I have allowed?  Given the delay it looks like 1 hour minimum?

I mean seriously, should I really have to allow 1 hour delays everytime I want to take the train for an appointment?

If I had to travel to a private medical appointment and it was far enough away to require travel by train, I'd start by allowing two hours.

Travelling by train doesn't necessarily mean its far, sometimes its just the most convenient method. We seem to be assuming, including me, that the delay was prior to boarding or the train was just on a go slow. It can be the train stops between stations and you're just stuck. Still would have allowed more than 20 minutes but it eliminates switching to another transport method.

A friend took the Stourbridge Shuttle, the whole line is 0.8 miles, was stuck on it for far longer than the 3 minutes it takes end to end because if there is a problem they still won't just open the doors and allow you to wander on the line etc. 

I used to travel extensively by train for work throughout the south-east and midland regions.  Shortest regular journey was 14 minutes and longest 3 hours plus including changing in London.  (It was cheaper than giving me a lease car, apparently, and I could work on the train)

For the 14 minute journey I'd aim at arriving at least an hour before the meeting.  Going to London or further (over two hours) I'd allow two hours.  Arriving early is rarely a problem.

I once had to get a £100 taxi journey authorised in place of a one hour train journey when the train was unexpectedly cancelled and - for once - I hadn't left enough time to allow a later train to get me there.

These things all depend on the importance of the meeting etc. A 14 minute train journey is a couple of miles at most and so viable via taxi. Personally wouldn't allow an extra hour on a 14 minutes journey but throughout my career we have had VC and mobiles so worst thing is I have to dial in. Sure there is the occasional meeting where you really want to be there in person but for those would more likely book a desk (internally or externally) and spend the day there. 

As an independent 2 hours waiting is 2 hours not paid hence better have a desk somewhere and work the whole time. 

New_in_the_fens

DullGreyGuy said:

New_in_the_fens said:

Sounds like you are on a half decent line. When I lived outside of London and commuted in we were on a little branch line and were the sacrificial lamb. Used to go to the station to go back home with a colleague, have a couple of beers and then go on our seperate trains. Unfortunately his station is known for jumpers however they have 6-8 trains an hour, after a fatality half the trains would be cancelled, the other half would be running but naturally rammed. My trains were 2 an hour.

It’s tricky - I tend to use Thameslink (cheapest). When I lived closer to London the rule I described generally held. 

Now I live rurally, the closest ‘big’ station is Peterborough (40 mins away), and I’m at the mercy of a twice an hour service. The local line to get there never tallies with the timings, so a 40-90 minute layover, so I drive. 

But to be honest, if I’m going to London for pleasure, I drive and get the tube from somewhere like Cockfosters.  Any appointments I include in a work day and no earlier than 10am. 

And if there is a fatality on the line, my husband will make the 90+ minute journey to Bedford to collect me by car - which is as far north as I can usually get, otherwise I may as well get a hotel. 

I’d rather never have to get a train, but needs must!

itwasntme001

p00hsticks said:

itwasntme001 said:

It still baffles me how a tresspasser can cause delays of close to an hour!  Surely you would ge the police to come over, arrest the person and that is the end of that?  All within 20min at most?

Well,  they have to find the person first. The chances are that the British Transport Police will have just received a phone call that there is someone on the line withe a rough indication of the location. They then have to get there themselves and try to locate the person and, if they can;t spot them, make 100% sure that the line is clear.

In my experience, it's often turned out to be someone simply taking  short cut and by the time the police get their they've disappeared of the line...

The delays actually continued for longer than an hour, there were still delays a few hours in.  Just does not make any sense.  If a simple thing like a tresspasser can cause this much problem, trains seem incredible vulnerable to minor issues.  Not fit for purpose and lesson learnt not to rely on it for things that cost me significant amounts.

Will be taking taxis to airports from now on!

itwasntme001

The thing about changing plans/route if train delays is once you are on you are kind of stuck until the next station, which might take a long while.  Even if you get to the next station to potentially change route, the announcments by train drivers on about the delays are either non-existent or incredbly vague or tells nothing about how long the delay could be.  So you are left thinking it can move any moment and all will be fine, but then you wait, and wait, and wait, and before you know it its too late.

So you either have to make a rule for yourself that says any delays, you just get off the next stop you can and re plan the route.  Or you suck it up and hope for the best.

Trains in this country are not fit for purpose.  Should not be used for anything time critical.  Lesson learnt and will avoid trains as much as possible in future.

Okell

DullGreyGuy said:

Okell said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Okell said:

itwasntme001 said:

400ixl said:

Yep, you will likely be eligible for delay repay from the train operator.

The fact that you did not allow enough time to take a delay into account is not the train lines problem and they are not responsible for any consequential losses.

I already allowed 20min.  How much time should I have allowed?  Given the delay it looks like 1 hour minimum?

I mean seriously, should I really have to allow 1 hour delays everytime I want to take the train for an appointment?

If I had to travel to a private medical appointment and it was far enough away to require travel by train, I'd start by allowing two hours.

Travelling by train doesn't necessarily mean its far, sometimes its just the most convenient method. We seem to be assuming, including me, that the delay was prior to boarding or the train was just on a go slow. It can be the train stops between stations and you're just stuck. Still would have allowed more than 20 minutes but it eliminates switching to another transport method.

A friend took the Stourbridge Shuttle, the whole line is 0.8 miles, was stuck on it for far longer than the 3 minutes it takes end to end because if there is a problem they still won't just open the doors and allow you to wander on the line etc. 

I used to travel extensively by train for work throughout the south-east and midland regions.  Shortest regular journey was 14 minutes and longest 3 hours plus including changing in London.  (It was cheaper than giving me a lease car, apparently, and I could work on the train)

For the 14 minute journey I'd aim at arriving at least an hour before the meeting.  Going to London or further (over two hours) I'd allow two hours.  Arriving early is rarely a problem.

I once had to get a £100 taxi journey authorised in place of a one hour train journey when the train was unexpectedly cancelled and - for once - I hadn't left enough time to allow a later train to get me there.

These things all depend on the importance of the meeting etc. A 14 minute train journey is a couple of miles at most and so viable via taxi. Personally wouldn't allow an extra hour on a 14 minutes journey but throughout my career we have had VC and mobiles so worst thing is I have to dial in. Sure there is the occasional meeting where you really want to be there in person but for those would more likely book a desk (internally or externally) and spend the day there. 

As an independent 2 hours waiting is 2 hours not paid hence better have a desk somewhere and work the whole time. 

A couple of miles!  No!  We obviously have different experiences of train travel!  My 14 (sorry) 17 minute journey covered over 20 miles and the train was much cheaper than a taxi would have been.

I worked in the NHS and didn't travel to any meetings where my presence wasn't absolutely necessary, but the nature of my job meant I had a lot of meetings.  I retired nearly 13 years ago and the NHS hadn't really come to terms with remote meetings etc at that time.  The most sophisticated piece of kit was a Blackberry.

Most of my meetings were at other hospitals or "business conference centre" type places and I could always find somewhere to work with a laptop if early.  I didn't waste my time.

Anyway, my point wasn't about work it's about not missing medical consultations - especially if you're paying for them.

Assuming it's an important consultation (ie important to me) and I was travelling by train, I would start off by allowing myself two hours of leeway.  If I arrive 60 minutes or even 90 minutes early I'm sure I'll find something to occupy myself - no worries.  If I've only left myself 20 minutes - well... different story...